More opponents like that and you could be in for an early retirement 
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Originally posted by jbpatzer
I played a few hands on Stars tonight, just to see what it was like.I'm going to give my opponent in this hand the benefit of the doubt and say that my turn check (I probably should have bet, but I'm trying to be more 'creative'. Lol.) fried his brain and my small river bet, which was hoping to induce a spazzy raise, made it evaporate altogether. Well played sir!
PokerStars Zoom No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from http://www.flopturnriver.com
Button ($117.52)
SB ($60.30)
BB ($68.01)
jbpatzer (UTG) ($50)
MP ($89.91)
CO ($53.38)Preflop: jbpatzer is UTG with 7♦, 7♠
jbpatzer bets $1.50, MP calls $1.50, 4 foldsFlop: ($3.75) 7♣, 10:spade:, 10:club: (2 players)
jbpatzer bets $2, MP calls $2Turn: ($7.75) A♠ (2 players)
jbpatzer checks, MP checksRiver: ($7.75) Q♥ (2 players)
jbpatzer bets $3.25, MP raises to $13.50, jbpatzer raises to $46.50 (All-In), MP calls $33Total pot: $100.75 | Rake: $2.50
Spoiler
jbpatzer had 7♦, 7♠ (full house, sevens over tens).
MP had A♣, 7♠ (Three pair! Wooooo!)
Outcome: jbpatzer won $98.25
But I haz 3 pairs!
Originally posted by jbpatzer
I'm going to give my opponent in this hand the benefit of the doubt and say that my turn check (I probably should have bet, but I'm trying to be more 'creative'. Lol.) fried his brain and my small river bet, which was hoping to induce a spazzy raise, made it evaporate altogether. Well played sir!
We had a similar hand in our book ... did you read it? I would like to see an in depth range analysis for this hand. What happens to villain's range, how does it look like with your bet-check-bet approach, what would be our other options (bet-bet-bet or bet-check-check).
If you post SUCH a hand you are obliged to explain all your thought processes and add details on Hero's and Villain's range. I don't let you get away with posting this hand and then just trolling about how bad your opponent is. Ofc vs such a bad player it doesn't matter what you do, the money will always fly in because he has "Three pair!"
Follow me on Snapchat and Twitter @Tw1ceT
The Education of a Modern Poker Player by TwiceT, jbpatzer & EmanuelC16
Originally posted by TwiceT
Originally posted by jbpatzer
I'm going to give my opponent in this hand the benefit of the doubt and say that my turn check (I probably should have bet, but I'm trying to be more 'creative'. Lol.) fried his brain and my small river bet, which was hoping to induce a spazzy raise, made it evaporate altogether. Well played sir!
We had a similar hand in our book ... did you read it? I would like to see an in depth range analysis for this hand. What happens to villain's range, how does it look like with your bet-check-bet approach, what would be our other options (bet-bet-bet or bet-check-check).
If you post SUCH a hand you are obliged to explain all your thought processes and add details on Hero's and Villain's range. I don't let you get away with posting this hand and then just trolling about how bad your opponent is. Ofc vs such a bad player it doesn't matter what you do, the money will always fly in because he has "Three pair!"
Lolz. I don't have time for that right now. Set it to your new mentees as an exercise. 
I'll give it a try.
Let's assume a calling range of ATo+ A9s+ KJo+ KTs+ QTs+ QJo JTs T9s 98s 22+
We can weight AK QQ+ much less assuming he 3bets. still possible though.
Flop.
His range in fact hits the board alright, there's not much he folds to a bet. Let's say 22-66, KQo KJo QJo, same things and A9s suited without fd/bd fd.
In fact it turns out to be roughly half of his range. We can bet big though, because what's left is calling anyway.
If he raises. With no reads that he can spew with anything less than AT/TT, just calling is going to be better EV by letting him catch smth or bluff.
I wouldn't discard any part of his range as raise on the flop though, since the hand is pretty much irrelevant there.
Turn.
An ace is actually a good card, more than a third of his range is aces. His range has now become:
FH+ ~10%
trips ~ 10%
A-pair ~35%
FD ~15%
KK-JJ ~15%
99-88 ~15%
98s which are not fds
That is, with the weightings applied for top combos, if any1 bothers to check.
At the same time, our range is A-heavy too. So I assume if we bet, he folds all pockets, and 98s nofd. All FDs though have straight draw to go with and will call. So, we have only 30% of his range folding. Moreover, these hands are unlikely to improve to pay us the river. Now, there's only 10% of hands that beat us.
If he raises. I would assume he's not gonna raise A or a trips, with A he's not ahead of anything and trips is likely to be calling to also call a third barrel from, say, AK.
Bluff is possible, but without reads I wouldn't say it's likely. In fact it looks like a good spot to be bluffing if we fold out aces.
Counclusion - Bet, close to pot.
River
I don't think we can get any value by checking, he's not gonna bet an ace or a trips. So it's only KJ and hands that beat us.
Looking into b/f.
If we bet big:
What calls? - straight, fh, quads. We're behind that.
Small:
Calls - AA, KJ, KT, AT, TT, QT, maybe JT, T9 or AQ.
without "maybe" we're far behind. With JT T9 we're 47/53 - no valuebet unless we think we can get AQ to call.
Phew... Aaand, jb, sorry for doing it in your blog, that's too long for skype I suppose 
Originally posted by jbpatzer
Lolz. I don't have time for that right now. Set it to your new mentees as an exercise.
Thnx JB for opening the floor. We will rape your entertaining blog a bit today and tomorrow for the sake of analyzing this hand from a few angles. I will firstly let my mentees (is that actually a real word 
) share their thoughts and then present my view on how to approach a hand evaluation on the basis of this specific one.
Thnx Insanity for your post, waiting for the others to comment as well before I join the discussion.
Follow me on Snapchat and Twitter @Tw1ceT
The Education of a Modern Poker Player by TwiceT, jbpatzer & EmanuelC16
I know i'm not a mentee, but i'm gonna have a go during my playing break ♦
Admittedly, since i've been playing HU Hypers exclusively i'd guess my ranges for SH cash are out a bit, but here goes...
Preflop: Use a standard villain calling range of 22-JJ, AT, AJ, AQ, some AK, KQ, KJ (?), TJs (?), TQs (?), TKs (?) 98s, 78s. Question marks are there because I don't think it's optimal to call these given the amount of broadways in our range after opening UTG, but they could very well be standard calls, especially deep.
Flop: His flatting range is pretty wide here, , 22-JJ, TJs, TQs, TKs, AT, AQ, AJ, AK, 98s, 78s.
Turn: Checking back is the first thing that really narrows his range down imo, Tx bets, and Ax bets. So after Turn check back i'd say his range is 22-JJ, 89s, 78s, 77, AT.
River: With the river raise i'd guess his range is 77, AT and bluffs with 89s or 78s (79s as well if we add that to his preflop calling range), 22-66 turning his hand into a bluff, although why they would do that after checking back the turn is beyond me. AQ can also raise for value here and get a call from any Ax, and obviously any QQ that flatted preflop and then flatted the flop as well. I guess sometimes AK can, although it's getting pretty thin when the only call you can get is from AJ.
And then you look at results and think "Wtf is going on"
Didn't have time for any mathematical analysis of the hand, as i'm only on a short 5 min break from playing
Here are my thoughts abt the hand w77.
pre vs unknown i put him on 55+, AJs+,AQo+,KQs,67s+,
prob calls QQ and AK
FLOP
I would bet bigger. I assume we are cbetting almost all of our range on this flop.
I don't think he is going to fold any pair, draws or broadways w BDFD.
Turn
I would bet 80% pot. If we bet he is going to continue with most of his flop calling range(all aces , trips, combo draws and prob JJ,QQ).
If we check we looks like we have an Ace and and check back all PPs weak aces, and good draws.He would bet trips, random floats and strong Aces.
River
Betting 75% pot, dont think he bluffs when checked to or thin vb Ace unlees he has AQ. He could still bluff reise some missed draws or turn made hand into bluff.
Just to let you know my, probably retarded, thoughts during the hand...
Preflop: I suppose he has good suited broadways, big aces, pairs, some suited connectors and some suited aces...no raggy Aces obviously, because that would just be silly. ^^
Flop: I've sucked all the life out of the flop, and I'm not thinking about balance here, although if I was I'd probably bet on the small side as it's hard to hit a paired flop. I'm really targetting flush draws and 89s and hoping to get paid off if he hits. I think there's a limit to how much I can extract from him if he has some mid pair or overpair, which is his most likely range for calling on the flop. If I'm lucky, he may peel with overcards and try to take it away on the turn. If he has a T, I'm probably getting his stack whatever I do.
Turn: The ace hits my range much better than his, so I don't really see the point in betting. I don't want to fold out his flush and straight draws.
River: After he checks back he most likely has some midpair, which may or may not bet the river, so I go for a thin value bet. When he raises, it's actually hard to see what I beat that can call my shove, but hey, I have a FH, I've underrepresented my hand and it's NL50, so he'll probably call a raise. I can see an argument for just calling, but he might slowplay Tx or AK or something, so I'm happy to go for max value. 
Nice to see the Modern Poker brand taking off. I have created a monster.... 
I was listening to the latest Experiments in Mass Appeal podcast in the car on the way home, and it was particularly good this week imo. You know that feeling you get when you hear a band for the first time and you just know you're going to love them? I have it big time with this one.....and they wear suits and ties, so they must be respectable and well-behaved. Seriously, this track is just awesome.
Ok lets see
In this positions both our and villains range consist mostly of pocket pairs, most suited broadways and AT+, with the exception of KK+ in villains range
That means nobody is giving up on this flop so we need to bet bigger ~ 2.75-3.
After villain calls our cbet his range doesnt change much at all, maybe he folds his lowest pockets but thats it
Now the turn is an interesting "scary" card. Without reads on villain we need reads on the player pool. Does the average nl50 zoom player is actually scared from this card or when we bet he perceives our range to be mostly air because in his mind we would check AQ, AJ, 88+ . Also if we check does he only bet his non showdown hands and checks back the rest? If thats the case i prefer betting because he still isnt folding much, he either improved to top pair or has a gutshot or the backdoor flush draw and he might raise those draws.
As played his range looks like the showdown value part of his flop calling range: the pocket pairs he didnt fold most likely 88+, maybe AJ, AQ if he is scared from value cutting himself and quads sometimes. AK, the tens and his draws i expect to be betting most of the time so he rarely has those on the river.
When we get raised on the river his range is some bluffs, quads, QQ, KJ and AQ. Does he call a shove with KJ and AQ? Most likely, if not we shouldn't be shoving.
I agree with the ranges we gave villain. However to me it looks like his turn calling range is pretty similar to his turn betting range when we check. When he hit A on turn he is happy he have a hand now and bets to annoy middle pairs (except maybe the smallest aces) and maybe to balance his draws that he also bets. He has no reason not to bet trips too. And he checks behind middle pairs. So if that assumption is true for him we get the same result on turn (bet or check/call) and can't manipulate his ranges too much except if we assume he do not fold JJ,QQ on turn in which case betting seems a bit better than checking (we are charging JJ,QQ and small aces).
So if we bet the turn and river I expect his river raise to be Tx, QQ, KJ. And I'm a nit so very few/no bluffs. All kinds of 3 pairs call, AK, AJ call too. Sometimes people call with busted draws that paired with the Q. So we bet river and call the raise since we are ahead of his value raising range but we are owning ourselves with a shove I think. (NIT ALERT 
There may be an argument that people at NL50 can't fold trips or nut straight but my problem with the shove is that all these combos may actually be split between his raising and calling range on the river while better FH would always raise.
So generally I like betting 3 streets vs unknown, I think we miss little value if we check turn and a lot of it if we check river.
Originally posted by TwiceT
... I will firstly let my mentees (is that actually a real word ?...
my favorite dictionary, urban dictionary, tells me that mentee is a word ...
Originally posted by Hamishk
Originally posted by TwiceT
... I will firstly let my mentees (is that actually a real word ?...my favorite dictionary, urban dictionary, tells me that mentee is a word ...
Even if it wasn't before, it certainly is now.
English is like that.
Dammit
Originally posted by VorpalF2F
Originally posted by Hamishk
Originally posted by TwiceT
... I will firstly let my mentees (is that actually a real word ?...my favorite dictionary, urban dictionary, tells me that mentee is a word ...
Even if it wasn't before, it certainly is now.
English is like that.
Dammit
mentee
Pronunciation: /mɛnˈtiː/
Definition of mentee
noun
a person who is advised, trained, or counselled by a mentor.
mentee in other Oxford dictionaries
The OED got there 1st or they update their web site very quickly
Ok my try:
MP calling range vs UTG without stats/reads:
AK, KQs, QQ-88 (do we think he sometimes slow plays KK+?), T9s, JTs (54combo)
Flop continue against C-bet range IP without stats/reads:
On the flop all his pocket pairs makes two pair + and I don’t believe he will fold any of them (25 combo) because he has position. I think we can also include AcKc, KcQc, AsKs, KsQs (4 combo). He also continues with all his T9s and JTs (4 combo). This means that he continues about 60% of the time.
I like the c-bet and the size.
Turn:
The As eliminates one (AsKs) combo out of his range. IMHO there are 5 combo (TT, T9s, JTs) which always, even with this big STR, gets the money in and we need not do much to get that done (we call this his "stack off range"). We have to try and get value from the other hands.
If we bet he probably folds: 88, 99, JJ and QQ (24 combo) and KsQs (1 combo) (we call this his "pair range")
If we check he bets his "stack off range" and probably AcKc the question is whether he bets anything else. The problem is that should he check behind then he probably has his "pair range" and should the river be an 8, 9 or Q then we may want to just slow down a bit because he may have filled up himself.
I like the check, with the intention to c/r. The intention should be, however, that should he check behind, to slowdown on a river 8, 9 or Q. (The Jack is not as bad because we can still get value from a Straight)
River:
With the Qh on the river I am less happy. There are now 3 additional combo in his "stack off range" and they all beat us.
I like the bet for value because we want AcKc to call us. Maybe if we lucky we get called by JJ because of our turn check.
When he raises we know that he believes he has a value hand. His value range should be JTs, T9s, TT and QQ (8 combo). We beat 4 combo and we lose to 4 combo so we get enough odds to call.
I do not like the raise All In because a thinking player should find a fold with JTs and T9s leaving us against the 4 combo that beat us.
Showdown:
WTF!? As said against a thinking player …..
O ye of little faith. Ofc mentee is word. Everything I write in my blog is true and fully verifiable.
I did a quick calculation on the way in to work this morning, and find that I have done just under half of my exam marking. Just. Under. Half. Hahahaha....ha.....ha.... 
Luckily, there's some good new music floating around at the moment, which is some consolation.
Let me join the fun
first what do we have no read on villain? which country? how many tables was he playing?
as for range:
reggy: ATs+ AJo+ 89s, TJs, JQs+, KQs+, 22+
recreational: A2+, T9s+, JTo+, JTs+, QTs+, K8s+, QTo+, KTo+, 22+, 56s, 67s 78s, 89s,
let's assume he can have monsters in his range.
vs the reg you can cbet as he is not folding almost anything since he has at the very least 2 over cards
vs recreational we keep A :club:2 :club:+, A7, AT+, T9s+, QTs+, K :club:8 :club:+, QTo+, KTo+, 22+, 67s, 78s, 89s
so again a good proportion of their range is staying
turn is a good card for both again... both either pick up some equity or top pair and you still crush their range. I would bet but bet small to possibly induce. and tank call to a raise. if it si small enough we should be able to keep a 100% of the range in and induce some raise from some hands from the reg
river again his range is crushed so I would bet / push and we look relatively weak recreational has a inelastic range and will call any size bet with his remaining Ax and Tx... reg will probabky still call with AQ, and Tx hands
Thanks for all the comments You mentioned many important points, good stuff! 
Most of you analyzed the hand from the perspective "how it should play out" and didn't discuss "how it has been played". Furthermore, most of you broke down ranges and went into what-if scenarios with both players ranges, a discussion on betsizing didn't get started though. When I look at such a hand, I would suggest to discuss it from two perspectives. Firstly how the hand has been played by Hero, secondly how the hand could/should play out.
Assumptions: Villian is unknown, we know some regulars on that limit and the fact that we have 0 information on MP leads us to believe that the odds are in favour of him being not an experienced reg on this limit. MP has a 180bb stack which at least tells us we are not playing against a SSS or MSS player.
Preflop ranges in both scenarios are the same, you talked about preflop at length already. I would say a tag has a ~ 10% calling range here consisting of: 22+, ATs+, KJs+, QJs, JTs, AQo+ A random fish can have pretty much anything, even A7o (30% range!?)
I) As played by JB
Flop: JB bets 2 into 3.75 - before moving ahead and discussing calling ranges we need to realize what such a small betsize does to Villain's range. There is a significant difference between a 1/2pot cbet and a 3/4 cbet. A-highs, K-highs, gutshots, lowest pockets might call to 1/2, but fold or (semi-)bluff raise vs a bigger bet. Its not villain who plays his range only, its our betsize that influences how that range is going to play to a big extent as well.
"I'm really targetting flush draws and 89s and hoping to get paid off if he hits. I think there's a limit to how much I can extract from him if he has some mid pair or overpair, which is his most likely range for calling on the flop." You yourself say you are targetting FDs, OESDs and pockets mostly. What you do though, is target a much wider range by betting half pot. If you'd say "I want to target the widest possible range to let him float the flop ... " your betsize is consitent with your statement. However, if you target the range you want to target, there is no need to bet so small. Bet 3/4 and really target those hands which are not folding to one bet anyway. 89 or 55 (the weakest hands of the range you target as you say) don't fold anyway. The other part of his range doesnt either. Before we bet the flop though, we need to have a plan. With your logic of hands you want to target, I would say a good plan is to bet bg on the flop and small on blank turns. No hand you mentioned will fold the flop with is the reason for the bigger flop bet. On a blank turn Villain might fold his range to a bigger bet though. By betting small we allow him to i) bluff raise and ii) call light ip in order to draw to the 2nd best hand and pay us off. In most cases I would also bet small on R not even thinking about the cards for now in my general plan, simply because a big-small-small approach on this texture with our assumptions maximizes our EV vs weak pairs who take the odds and call as well as maximizes our EV vs hands who want to bluff and read our sizing as weak.
Now that we have a general plan before betting on the flop, we are set to dive into postflop. JB decides to bet small on the flop and gets called. Turn is a "scare card" and one we would bluff frequently. I think going ahead and betting small again is a solid option. We lose a little bit of value vs A-highs with a small turn bet, but we maximize vs lower pairs and increase the chances to get bluffraised be the gs floats like J9. Also spades-floats can easily call and draw to a 2nd best hand. The fact, that we slightly lose value on the turn vs A-high is not so critical though because after a small-small approach on F and T we should bet big on the R. Reason being is, that the weak part of his range cannot really bluff catch R now since after the line we took we too often have a hand that beats him, we mostly get folds anyway by 88. FD, OESD that didnt bluff till now, probably wont bluff the R either, so we also dont have to attack those hands (check-call is an option you might think, I do agree, a viable option because Ax bets anyway and busted draws might bet too). We dont block Ax combos which is great, so we target all the Ax hands that floated F and called T. A decent part of Villain's range as most of you discussed earlier already. Hence, betting R bigger after going small-small before is a solid idea.
JB had a different plan though with which I disagree. He went small-check-small. I would even argue, that he didn't have a clear plan on the turn what to do after he checked vs different kinds of betsizes from MP. Now that MP checked back, we can assume he doesnt have Tx ever. We are looking at 22-99, K-high FDs, sometimes Ax being a bit deceptive and potcontrolling. Against this range, I dont see any reason to bet. Now on the R it is really obvious "that we had hit our A on the T and didnt want to force our opponent away". T is such a good scare card, why would we not bet T but bet R? Villain can easily fold weak pairs and K highs, and call Ax. Ergo: we should not bet imo, but check again (JB - remember the hand from our book????????? "checking twice, I didn't know that was an option ...."). We should go for a check-raise, expecting Villain to check back pairs and K-high but bed busted draws and especially Ax. Our line is quite goofy in Villain's eyes so you will mostly see Ax tank-call our check-raise.
II) How I would appraoch the hand
Given the limited information and the flop texture, I see three lines worth taking. I will try to briefly cover all of them.
1. check/raise - bet - betAI
This line targets pairs that bet the flop when checked to (most of them I'd assume) and then feel like getting bluffed and not believing and calling one or more streets. Ofc it also gets the money in vs Tx, but we don't need to focus on those combos too much as we always get it in anyway. This line is especially powerful vs weaker players since they have a hard time letting go pockets on that board, especially 88+. Against a pocket pair heavy range this turn card would be bad, because it gives us quite some fold equity. I would bet the turn small and mostly focus on Ax of clubs and the occasional JJ that still don't want to fold. I think at that point we lose our customers 22-66 every time and 88, 99 mostly. We don't gain much by checking turn and betting R, its too obvious that we don't want to scare these pockets away on T and value bet R. In any case, I would shove the R, expecting to only get called by Ax(mostly in clubs) or Tx. That's fine, checking doesn't accomplish much since Villain more often has Ax than busted clubs which want to bluff.
2. bet - bet - bet
This line has been discussed the most so far. T is a good bluff card and since we would bluff here with all FDs, OESD, GSs we want to value bet as well. 99 might still call one, all (broadway floaty) spades combos call anyway, all Ax call. We only fold out all the small pockets and floats who now dont dare to bluff raise. On the river we just bet again and dont expect Ax to fold because both FDs are busted. I would not fold against a raise ever, especially if we bet on the smaller side. Villain can very well put us on a AJ, AQ, AK value bet and try to raise us off it repping a FH with his busted OESD, FD .... or even turning a made hand into a bluff (99, JJ).
3. check/call - check/call - check/raiseAI
JB said we have no reads, no hands on our opponent. Still if we played a few hands vs this opponent, we could have picked up on one hand he played before or one tendency. Maybe not a read already, but having the feeling MP is slightly aggressive makes me consider this line. By checking the flop we immediately reverse our range and put MP into the driver's seat. I would argue almost all hands would bet, especially pockets for protection and all (also weak) draws for fold equity. A-high will check back regularly, especially AQ, AJ for decent enough showdown value. If we face a bet we check/call representing A-high our medium pairs mostly. I would continue representing a weak range all the way to the R and c/rai. Our range looks "face-up" after being PFR from UTG and then check/calling 2 streets postflop, many aggressive players would just bet-bet-(overbet)shove as a default (TwiceT in 2009 would have done exactly that).
I can already picture JB jumping out of his chair at uni and asking "But what if MP checks back F? You didn't think about that hah?". I did sir; easy answer professor: Our range assessment still holds true, the range just clearly shifts to Ax hands. Those would call pre in those positions and often not bet on the F. Since the turn is an A we don't need to bet as Villain will bet for us. We can then decide whether to check/raise (I like it because its unexpected and players don't fold Ax here ever) or check/call and represent a weak Ax. Again, I see JB pointing the finger and saying "What if MP doesn't bet the T? You didn't consider that option hah!". Ofc I did sir; Now we have to think about what it means if Villain checks back 2 streets with our range assumption and what our range looks like to him. We clearly look super weak, 99 being probably our strongest hand here in his eyes. MP still has low pockets, those might call a very small bet. He might still have Ax quite a bit where he thought he can only get one street of value and wanted to delay to the R and maybe spike a bluff or just value bet himself. I would therefore check/raise the R big and represent a bluff and represent the fact that "I know you know I have nothing, but I know you have nothing as well so I bluff you and you cannot call".
Before JB jumps at me asking "What if we check/call F and villain checks back T?" The A is an interesting card. We could very well have strong A-high and check/call the F. However, what is the point in betting R? We represent AK, AQ way too much. I rather continue representing 7x, 88 etc. As a consequence I would check the R to MP, knowing that he would check back 99 but also knowing that we don't get him to call anyway given the previous actions and the board texture. Often enough though MP will bet A-high on the F and then be surprised to have hit an A on the T and snap check back. Once we check the R again, he will most likely bet and we can again make a funky check/raise that will confuse the shit out of Villain, mostly resulting in him calling just to see whats up.
There is merit to all the lines. Which one to take depends on our opponents. Whenever we have no stats, we need to make use of all other infos out there. Even without any info we should still have an idea how the game is been played on this specific limit on that specific poker room. Be aware how the betsizing of both players massively influences ranges and influences our decisions. We will mostly play against opponents we have some notes/stats on, that's why it is important not only to consider all our options but also finding the best line vs each opponent while not neglecting to have balanced ranges in most spots.
Follow me on Snapchat and Twitter @Tw1ceT
The Education of a Modern Poker Player by TwiceT, jbpatzer & EmanuelC16
Lol. So many pictures of me. I don't really do jumping out of my chair or pointing fingers....I tend to emote with my eyebrows. I do remember the hand in the book ofc. And I was planning to c/r the turn. Idk. It's a tough old game.