JJ - Overpair on paired flop - Best Play?

If big money goes in here, do you expect to win that pot?

The answer should be no, and therefore you do not have a very clear value raise on the flop. When you are getting reraised, you should begin counting your outs. They are 2 in number.

If you think that bets, raises and reraises look bluffy, then you need to rethink. If flop and turn are disasters, then the river is a cataclysm. Sorry about too much bluntness:)

In such spots I tend to call down most of the times.
What happens if you don't raise any of the streets?

- You probably lose some value vs lower pockets but I doubt many of them will stack off anyway . Most of the time they fold to flop raise or call flop raise and check/fold rest of the hand.
- There are few turn/river cards that would be bad but you still have position. You can still call vs over cards.
- You keep much wider range for villain and let him bet weaker hands / bluffs aswell.
- You pretty much play your hand face up. There are no draws that you raise on the flop, you probably still 3-bet QQ+ and most of the times just float with decent over cards. 77/88/99 seems like a flat preflop. At least that's my general assumptions vs unknown if I'm the CO here.

Bad raise by you and even worse raise by villain :f_biggrin:.

YohanN7 and nvelev already told you why not to raise so I'm not going to write anymore the same things.

lawl it's so simple. Great answer, YohanN7 and nvelev Usually I rather call a bet but it's not bad to try out new lines sometimes. This one wasn't that good

Originally posted by MisterSnS
lawl it's so simple. Great answer, YohanN7 and nvelev Usually I rather call a bet but it's not bad to try out new lines sometimes. This one wasn't that good

Great attitude!

I agree with the guys and would like to note that raise/call on flop is even worse. if you raise - go all the way .

I think after he 3bets at NL5 its most of the time value. But NL25 do not know. Really board is dry and villain might want to keep bluffs in. BUt on the other hand, villain might want to get value from your JJ while it looks strong , because if Q+ comes, you might fold it.

Calling probably is good as some say - small overpairs will not stack off here. But what about protection vs overcards? AK, Aq, KQ?

BTw I also think that vs CO we can 3bet this preflop. He can call a lot OOP. Agro villains will 4bet bluff.

You probably lose some value vs lower pockets but I doubt many of them will stack off anyway . Most of the time they fold to flop raise or call flop raise and check/fold rest of the hand.

actually an idea came: if this generates much fold equity that only the nuts will call - we have good bluff with our trash ? By raise flop and barrel turn.

Yeah but I would be very cautious with those kinds of plays. There are many guys out there who level themselves on those boards and still call down with their AK or pockets. That's why I decided to raise the flop and put him in a levelling situation. What I didn't realize was that he levelled me after his 3bet and I shot myself in my own foot Further, some only call down with QQ+, trips and sets. Thus, we kinda value-town ourselves eventually

3betting preflop is not bad at all, but I only like to do it vs. guys who call a lot vs. 3bets. Vs this specific villain I would have folded if he'd 4bet pre, so it's just better to call imo. We have the same reasoning for the postflop-play btw (as I am realizing now haha)

Well, I think all has been said
Would've called OTF as well rather than raise but I admire your approach and try. We can only learn by experience.