Skip to forum
Notifications
Clear all

Pot sized donk on the river. Is it a call ?

9 Posts
8 Users
0 Reactions
623 Views
diminem99
Joined: 06.04.2015

Hi everyone,

Very standard Cbet on the flop.
Once he checks to me on the turn, I consider checking back but I decide to fire an other barrel to get him off 55-JJ, AJ, or make him fold broadways that could hit on the river.
There are possibilities he has a Queen, but I also suspect he floated the flop guessing I didn't hit much.

Then he donks big on the river. So either I am beat by a better Ace, 2 pairs, or he has a monster like 33 or 44 in his hands, or he is bluffing with air, thinking I have a Queen and trying to get me off of it with a pot sized bet.

Is this a call here ?

PokerStars - €0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

UTG: 94 BB (VPIP: 14.55, PFR: 10.91, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 58)
Hero (CO): 173.6 BB
BTN: 51.2 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 22.22, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 9)
SB: 86.6 BB (VPIP: 12.00, PFR: 4.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 27)
BB: 20.2 BB (VPIP: 30.00, PFR: 22.50, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 43)

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has T♠ A♣

fold, Hero raises to 3.4 BB, fold, SB calls 3 BB, fold

Flop: (7.8 BB, 2 players) Q♠ 4♥ 3♦
SB checks, Hero bets 4.8 BB, SB calls 4.8 BB

Turn: (17.4 BB, 2 players) 3♥
SB checks, Hero bets 11 BB, SB calls 11 BB

River: (39.4 BB, 2 players) A♠
SB bets 37 BB, Hero ???


Reply
Quote
8 replies
sapef
Joined: 17.10.2011

hello.
in flop is a very standar CB but, if you have a player that u know is floating, or calling to much is there 2 lines that i prefer:
1- if he fold allot to a turn CB then u should bet flop and turn
2- simply check the flop and get your hand on the show down .

if u fired 2 times and get a big donk on the river there is a population read in the micros :
when the people CC 2 times and then donk on the river he almost always have a nut hand .


Reply
Quote
nathanrenard
Joined: 10.02.2009

To me cbet Turn here is unnecessary, sample size is small, but a 12/4 with less than 100bb is just waiting for a hand like this to cash in a bit. Imho he has some Ax in his range here, and just can't play them nicely.

And also +1 on this:

Originally posted by sapefif u fired 2 times and get a big donk on the river there is a population read in the micros :
when the people CC 2 times and then donk on the river he almost always have a nut hand .


Reply
Quote
nitrol
Joined: 24.07.2010

I think board is dry and we will not achieve much with our turn bet.
Villain's line is strong on micro limits, there are possible better Ax so we fold.


Reply
Quote
inceptioner
Joined: 23.05.2012

I don't like c-betting the turn. And if we check back the turn like we should, we have a lot easier decisions on the river.


Reply
Quote
Hesticus
Joined: 24.06.2008

The flop was very dry. I would check the turn here since with such a board villain has many Qx and pocket pairs in his hand.


Reply
Quote
YohanN7
Joined: 15.06.2009

The river is an easy fold.

The question itself (... he has a monster like 33 or 44 in his hands, or he is bluffing with air, ... Is this a call here ?) is not a very good one. You'll generally get a number of random "reads" from random posters, each with his or hers preconceived idea of what a pot sized river donk means.

The proper approach is instead to figure out what your though process should be. This does not include figuring out whether he is bluffing or not. Villain bluffing enters merely as an estimated (by you!) probability that he is bluffing. Then you consider the size of the bet and the strength of you hand. Then you decide.

Most often, the reason a hand ends up here is that it is unknown by the poster whether villain is bluffing. In this case, only the bet size and the strength of you hand matters. At any rate, random opinions on whether it is a bluff or not are totally useless the next time a similar scenario occurs. At the very least, it is useless at one or two notches higher limit where people are less predictable.


Reply
Quote
la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

call-call-donk is often for value. River is a easy fold.
Flop is dry and that Qx doesn't hit neither of you very hard, I think you can cbet but it is unnecessary.
After flop cbet I would not bet turn.


Reply
Quote
diminem99
Joined: 06.04.2015

Thank you for the feedback everyone.

Sapef, that population read looks like very sound advice! Thank you !


Reply
Quote