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QQ on the River - Valuebet or Not?

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MisterSnS
Joined: 09.11.2011

888 Poker - $0.10 NL (6 max) FAST - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): 107.6 BB
SB: 171.8 BB (VPIP: 23.46, PFR: 18.52, 3Bet Preflop: 4.92, Hands: 167)
BB: 98.5 BB
UTG: 219.5 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 33.33, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 6)
MP: 176.4 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 2)
CO: 104.5 BB (VPIP: 16.67, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 6)

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q♥ Q♦

UTG raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, Hero raises to 8 BB, fold, fold, UTG calls 5 BB

Flop: (17.5 BB, 2 players) T♠ 2♣ 9♦
UTG checks, Hero bets 9 BB, UTG calls 9 BB

Turn: (35.5 BB, 2 players) 7♠
UTG checks, Hero bets 19 BB, UTG calls 19 BB

River: (73.5 BB, 2 players) 9♠
UTG checks, Hero checks

The title says it. Villain is unknown. Since he's not raising my turn cbet and quickly checks the river, there's definitely a reason to bet here. I didn't because I was afraid of getting raised a lot too.

1) Would you size the Flop and Turn differently?
2) Would you bet the river for value, and which sizing?

My estimated calling-range would be Toppairs and JJ.


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10 replies
Mozzek
Joined: 16.07.2016

I believe the sizings are ok. As well as checking OTR, 9 of spades is a bad card imo. He might be trapping there easily.


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la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

OTR I would just check because I don't think villain can call a third barrel with any hand that we beat.
Sizings look ok.


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partyace7
Joined: 19.07.2012

Yeah, i think that is X OTR.
IF u want to value bet then u must go w a size that u are sure that hands like JJ, JTs,ATs will call (i guess ~1/3 PSB or smaller).

Also i think that 3B QQ PRE is a bit loose vs UTG and when vilan 4B, you will be in a though spot. I like to 3B 4value KK+ and some of the AK.


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nitrol
Joined: 24.07.2010

I like the way you played it.
I think that QQ is not a 3b preflop vs unknown but still it is ok.


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Alleen86
Joined: 27.05.2010

If we target JJ and top pairs, imo we could bet the river small (like 1/3 - 1/4). The downside is that we would have to fold vs a raise, so we would be exploitable to bluffs. The good thing is that an average is not bluffing alot in those spots.


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nsavov
Joined: 24.09.2010

Wow, you people dont like value, huh?
3bet sizing is ok if you 3bet wide.
I dont agree with postflop sizings. You set up a pot shove OTR. I like a little bigger bets to set up a lower river shove on most cards. Backdoor flush that pairs second pair is on the safe side of cards.

OTR you are losing mostly to QJ of spades (he can have it because you 3bet small). 1 combo. Sets would have raised by the turn.
I would have shoved - its quite thin but we can get looked up by worse often enough.

Edit: 98s makes alot of sense too so thats 3 combos that we lose to, which makes it alot closer but we still have some edge. :f_drink:


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la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

Hero has JJ+, a lot of flushes and A9s in his range when he shoves OTR.
What hands will villain call that we beat? He definitely should not call with TPTK against hero's range and JJ would be kinda bad call too.

So when you say we will get looked up by worse often enough, what hands do you think will do that?


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nitrol
Joined: 24.07.2010

Shoving river is not ok. Every 9x and flush beat you...


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pisiattu
Joined: 01.04.2010

Imho in this flop you can also check back: he call TT 99 and JJ, bds+ backdoor but you blocker qjs; you can check 4 induce

As played wp imho


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nitrol
Joined: 24.07.2010

We should cbet this flop. We miss value when we x.


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