AKs 4x OR from MP vs. BTN Call

bet-bet-bet. 70%-40%-70%.

I would c-bet here with nut flush draw, no idea why you check flop? would bet turn also as he might fold hands like 77,88,99 , not sure i would bet river if he called 2 streets he most likely would call after river also as that card didnt change much .

Originally posted by rompas
I would c-bet here with nut flush draw, no idea why you check flop? would bet turn also as he might fold hands like 77,88,99 , not sure i would bet river if he called 2 streets he most likely would call after river also as that card didnt change much .

I see why checking flop is really bad but the thought process was that I don't want him to just fold on the flop when I have a chance to stack him here if I do hit the NF.

B f!

Originally posted by TakingAShot
I see why checking flop is really bad but the thought process was that I don't want him to just fold on the flop when I have a chance to stack him here if I do hit the NF.

This situation occurs often, and you have to bet here. The only reason you would check in this situation is if you have reads that your opponent cbets too much, so go for a check raise.

You have a strong draw to the nuts, you want to build a pot as soon as possible.
If he checks back, and you hit your flush, the pot is a mere .19 cent, and there's no chance of stacking him.
Your fault lies in planning, always consider actions and pot sizes on later streets.

Originally posted by DecMate

Originally posted by TakingAShot
I see why checking flop is really bad but the thought process was that I don't want him to just fold on the flop when I have a chance to stack him here if I do hit the NF.

This situation occurs often, and you have to bet here. The only reason you would check in this situation is if you have reads that your opponent cbets too much, so go for a check raise.

You have a strong draw to the nuts, you want to build a pot as soon as possible.
If he checks back, and you hit your flush, the pot is a mere .19 cent, and there's no chance of stacking him.
Your fault lies in planning, always consider actions and pot sizes on later streets.

I was betting my draws strong and then (now) I've gone what seems like forever without hitting a draw. I kept betting, building the pot, and missing. Having to check back rivers with ace high and getting called literally EVERY time I bluffed. It's just ripping money out of my bankroll on a daily basis. I'm hitting absolutely nothing.

I understand why that's bad logic and results based thinking but when you're 15 BI's down and nothing is going right, bad habits start to develop.

edit: I looked at a few more hands where I was drawing and I've definitely started playing them too passively. I do understand that "I haven't hit one in a while" isn't a sound reason to stop making profitable decisions.

My line would be bet-bet-bet(probably).
OTF you have nut flush draw, backdoor straight draw and 2 overs. Clear spot for a value bet, or optionally go for a check raise.
OTT you pick up more equity and I would barrel again.
OTR when you miss a hand like this, I believe it is reasonable to go for a 3 barrel bluff.

Originally posted by la55i
My line would be bet-bet-bet(probably).
OTF you have nut flush draw, backdoor straight draw and 2 overs. Clear spot for a value bet, or optionally go for a check raise.

Yeah, I guess if I won't get aggressive there I've gotten way too passive.

My concern with check raising strong draws and strong missed hands is that I've been blowing people off their hand a lot lately when I had my biggest holdings. Is this also something that I should just remain consistent in and try and ignore short term results?

Is this also something that I should just remain consistent in and try and ignore short term results?

You can pretty much always ignore short term results.
If they fold a lot when you bet with a good hand, then start betting with more bad hands too.

Originally posted by la55i

Is this also something that I should just remain consistent in and try and ignore short term results?

You can pretty much always ignore short term results.
If they fold a lot when you bet with a good hand, then start betting with more bad hands too.

Very cool. I was actually working on balancing my post flop play a bit more as I know I've become far too face up lately. I'm sure that's a big part of the problem in extracting value and I'm also pretty sure now that the player pool has noticed how much my aggression has backed off. Several of us have a decent sample size on each other now (for 2NL).

It's unusual to find a studying, thinking player @ 2NL on the US facing rec networks. It's relatively unusual to find someone who's *not* working hard on their game at any level on WPN.

So the question boils down to whether you want to moan about your beats and keep thinking the wrong way about poker, or take advice from people who have been in your position and thrived.

I understand variance can be frustrating, but you simply cannot think in this way. Often you won't hit the right outs. Often you will make bluffs and be called, but that's poker.

Don't focus on the money lost or won - focus on making the right decisions. Money will take care of itself, eventually.

Originally posted by DecMate
So the question boils down to whether you want to moan about your beats and keep thinking the wrong way about poker, or take advice from people who have been in your position and thrived.

I understand variance can be frustrating, but you simply cannot think in this way. Often you won't hit the right outs. Often you will make bluffs and be called, but that's poker.

Don't focus on the money lost or won - focus on making the right decisions. Money will take care of itself, eventually.

I'm going to listen to people who have been in my shoes and thrived. This is clearly a confidence and faith issue and it's drastically effecting my decisions at the table. It's time to wake back up.

Originally posted by TakingAShot

Originally posted by DecMate

Originally posted by TakingAShot
I see why checking flop is really bad but the thought process was that I don't want him to just fold on the flop when I have a chance to stack him here if I do hit the NF.

This situation occurs often, and you have to bet here. The only reason you would check in this situation is if you have reads that your opponent cbets too much, so go for a check raise.

You have a strong draw to the nuts, you want to build a pot as soon as possible.
If he checks back, and you hit your flush, the pot is a mere .19 cent, and there's no chance of stacking him.
Your fault lies in planning, always consider actions and pot sizes on later streets.

I was betting my draws strong and then (now) I've gone what seems like forever without hitting a draw. I kept betting, building the pot, and missing. Having to check back rivers with ace high and getting called literally EVERY time I bluffed. It's just ripping money out of my bankroll on a daily basis. I'm hitting absolutely nothing.

I understand why that's bad logic and results based thinking but when you're 15 BI's down and nothing is going right, bad habits start to develop.

edit: I looked at a few more hands where I was drawing and I've definitely started playing them too passively. I do understand that "I haven't hit one in a while" isn't a sound reason to stop making profitable decisions.

Your problems are understandable.
I am not ashamed to say that i am someone who finds that bouncing back difficult after a losing session when nothing goes right and lose almost all the pots when you had 30-50% (or more) chance to win.
As this hand goes you have lots of equity and no chance for your opponent making a str8. Bet out OTF and Q is a good card to fire a second barrel. Evaluate OTR but i like the suggested line to bet out again and if he didnt hit the Q or a set he will lay it down his average pocket pair or T. If He calls down 2 streets you have less chance to win with an overcard so for that reason too id fire a 3rd barrel.

It's like doing something good for you. Like say when you were a kid and your mother tells you to eat broccoli. You know short term you're going to hate it, but long term its +EV for the body
Try to think of poker in this sense. If you have the right outlook and consistently make the correct decisions, over time money will flow, despite the sour taste right now.

I like your broccoli example a lot ♦