A proper loyalty programme is finally introduced on Natural8.com - the Fish Buffet

Even odds on the spins? Or what are the percentages on the spins? What's the point of the bronze/silver/gold/platinum/etc?

Hello Shevtshenko,

The spins are not spun at even odds. It will be weighted based on the respective levels as shown in the first table above so that the expected average cashback is as per the specified percentages.

(Edit: the question under the spoiler about the odds of particular prizes no longer requires an answer as it has been answered by Kyyberi below; I'm keeping it here for historical purposes only.)

They say it's "UP TO 50% RAKEBACK", not that it is. They mean that you might get that, but probably you don't.

Thank you so much for the image :f_love:, this is exactly what I needed!

Originally posted by Kyyberi
They say it's "UP TO 50% RAKEBACK", not that it is. They mean that you might get that, but probably you don't.

I meant the EV.

I'm too lazy to check the numbers for all the levels, but I've put the numbers into Excel for the 'VIP' and 'Black Shark' levels and found out that their EVs are $1500.00425 and $500.022, respectively, which is a tiny bit more than 50% of the required rake. Or, say, for 'Gold Octopus', the EV is $51.0012, which is about 34% of $150. So the advertised expected cashback percentages are accurate.

Examples of the standard deviations of the rewards are:

VIP ~ $901.89
Black Shark ~ $308.57
Gold Octopus ~ $25.59.

Since I am Shark I got 4 times in a row the lowest price which is a propability of ~1:1000.

in the other levels I also ran below EV but not that much..

Any other player having the same experience?

My last 5 spins have been the minimum. Out of last 10 spins I think 7 has been minimum and 3 are non-biggest.

Originally posted by kingpowl
Since I am Shark I got 4 times in a row the lowest price which is a propability of ~1:1000.

Under the assumption that those odds are identically distributed for all players. But it's also possible that players are put in to different buckets/tiers with different probabilities. Similar to the market leader.

FB support told me its random

Doesn't clash with a different probability distribution for each player. Different skewness still possible.

and imo illegal if they dont communicate it

you cannot state the probabilities of getting certain rewards is this and that percentage and even calculate the estimated EV in public (here) when there is in fact a hidden attribute that screws it all up.

Today I have had the minimum for the fith time in a row, just like Kyyberi. This is beyound ridiculous.

FB support. "Other players are not having issues with this"

I would highly appreciate it if more people would share their data. Everybody is welcome not only those who run bad Waiting to hear from Natural8Rep / Pokerstrategy as well..

Hello guys,

We checked this with the network:

1. GGNetwork uses the RNG as certified by UKGC, and the tables on the website coincides with our simulations.
2. Players, naturally, will have variances in their FB rewards.
3. Data of other players cannot be shared in public.

Regards

I'm sorry for disturbing this thread - I had been looking for the probability info at N8's site, while they're listed on a page at another web domain that opens when one clicks on the 'What's Fish Buffet?' link in the Fish Buffet section in the poker client, here's this link. Right now, the probabilities listed there are the same as in Kyyberi's screenshots, but if they change, look for the updated values on that webpage.

Originally posted by kingpowl
I would highly appreciate it if more people would share their data. Everybody is welcome not only those who run bad Waiting to hear from Natural8Rep / Pokerstrategy as well..

Last weekend, I restarted playing on N8 after an almost 3-month break. My 'PokerCraft EV' (i.e. EV plus rake) was only slightly above 0 over the weekend, and my actual winnings were significantly above it, to the extent that my 'rake' according to the 'loser takes all' method (i.e. the earned Fish Points divided by 100) was around 83% of the rake actually paid (the latter is calculated as the difference between the PokerCraft winloss and the actual winloss as per the account balance), as expected due to a positive PokerCraft winloss.

Although I performed like an 'average player' (i.e. I'd be losing to the rake in the long run if I continued playing so bad) and was multitabling, I ran very hot in the Buffet spins, here are my prizes from them during my climb:

Plankton $0.50 (the smallest)
Shrimp $2.50 (the 2nd biggest)
Bronze Goldfish $5 (the 2nd biggest)
Silver Goldfish $5
Gold Goldfish $5
Bronze Crab $25 (the biggest)

So I've got $43 from the spins, which was above the EV of the rewards that was $0.75 + $2 + $3.30 + $3.75 + $4.20 + $14 = $28 in my case.

@Fish buffet: There is a player based coefficient coming into your final rakeback (this was somewhere in their T&C, at least some time ago). It's formula is kept unknown to public, so regs obviously won't ever get the promised percentage. It sucks considering close to uncapped rake.

Originally posted by JohnDoe1313
@Fish buffet: There is a player based coefficient coming into your final rakeback (this was somewhere in their T&C, at least some time ago). It's formula is kept unknown to public, so regs obviously won't ever get the promised percentage. It sucks considering close to uncapped rake.

Could you be referring to the old loyalty system where 35% cashback was issued every Monday and not the current Fish Buffet that was just launched on 30th October?

Yes, it might be that, my bad.