Originally posted by RubbyDubby
How the f... can you call that shit! :D.
Yeah, how can I?
I mean...
...I just wanted to give you a great example of how to follow my guide of course! ♠_cool:
Apparently you did well.
Congratulations to your nice NL5 performance again!
I should check out this folding stuff you are linking.
I might post some other hands over in the other forum. I think this one was really too obvious to put it on there. In which spot would you 3bet? You mean the flop?
My castigation continues:
whip-lash #2
PokerStars - $0.02 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
BB: $1.82 (VPIP: 21.51, PFR: 6.45, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 94)
UTG: $2.00 (VPIP: 18.18, PFR: 15.91, 3Bet Preflop: 7.14, Hands: 44)
CO: $2.28 (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 22.22, 3Bet Preflop: 7.69, Hands: 37)
Hero (BTN): $5.39
SB: $2.01 (VPIP: 40.00, PFR: 8.57, 3Bet Preflop: 5.56, Hands: 35)
SB posts SB $0.01, BB posts BB $0.02
Pre Flop: (pot: $0.03) Hero has Q♦ A♦
fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.05, SB raises to $0.16, fold, Hero calls $0.11
Flop: ($0.34, 2 players) K♣ T♣ 8♦
SB bets $0.02, Hero raises to $0.30, SB calls $0.28
Turn: ($0.94, 2 players) J♣
SB bets $0.02, Hero raises to $0.73, SB calls $0.71
River: ($2.40, 2 players) 3♠
SB bets $0.02, Hero raises to $2.38
This hand actually happend a bit earlier then the foregoing and exactly against the infamous min-bet-BB who also participated above. I only have 35 hands on him, but also in this case we can already observe some clear tendencies:



So this guy loves to bet. And at this point I think, that I already had noticed, that he not only loves to bet, but that he especially loves to min-bet and hardly ever does anything else. When it comes to calling/folding, there aren't a lot of stats available, but he at least had proved, that he CAN fold. So as well as his post-flop betting behavior doesn't have any significance, when it comes to putting him on a range, his calling very well should be considered.
When it comes to pre-flop one should notice his high VPIP/PFR stat. So his pre-flop calling range seems to be pretty wide compared to his betting range. On the other hand, he already had 3bet one steal attempt. So he at least seems to have a range for that which despite his low PFR must not nesseceraly be very strong. As the sample size is way to small for any qualified assumptions in this regard, I will work with my default 3betting range for this situation while thinning out some of the bluffs. That leaves us with:
JJ+, AQ+, A8s-A2s, K9s-K6s, QTs-Q8s, J9s-J8s, T9s-T8s, 98s-87s
I still haven‘t worked out my calling range in this spot, which is a shame, but intuitively I will go with:
QQ-99, AJ+, ATs, KQo, KTs+, QJs-T9s, QTs-J9s
Probably I should balance this out by adding some AA and KK combos for protection. I don't think, that I should add too many of the very speculative hands, as VILLAIN's post-flop betting-pattern doesn't give hope for a lot of implied odds. My hand AQs though definitely should be a call.
Now lets look at the flop:
K♣ T♣ 8♦
In terms of equity my range (103 combos) is with 53.62% just slightly ahead of VILLAIN's range (115 combos). My actual hand only is at 42.54% percent though. Although I only have a slight range advantage I think that I can try to take back initiative at the flop and polarize my range. Another option (and probably the much better one) would have been to simply keep this hand in my calling range as a draw. After all VILLAIN was granting me wonderful pot-odds. As a starter it couldn't harm figuring out, how a balanced betting-range would look like.
Assuming, that with my value hands I would bet 2/3 of the pot on every street, a balanced betting range would include 29% bluffs on the river, 53% on the turn and 67% on the flop. So to determine a balanced amount of bluffs, I should first define my value-betting range for the flop which is:
TT (3 combos)
AK (12)
KTs (3)
KQ half of the time (4.5)
KJs half of the time (1.5)
That totals to 24 value combos and respectively 49 bluffs. So I could bluff here almost half of my total range and call/fold with only about one forth.
As my hand ( Q♦ A♦ ) has a gutshot draw together with a backdoor nut-flush-draw and an overcard as well as some blocker-effects for AA, AK and QQ, which might all be in VILLAIN's continuing range, it seems to make an excellent bluff for the first street. Now let's define VILLAINS continuing-range and calculate fold equity. After blocker-effects his range consists of still 91 combos.
Spoiler
he might 3bet with 9 combos:
AA (3)
KK (3)
K8s (3)
and call with 48 combos:
QQ (3)
JJ+ (6)
AK (9)
AQ without AcQc half of the time (4)
AcQc (1)
A8s-A2s in clubs (7)
K9s (3)
K7s-K6s (6)
Qc9c-Qc8c (2)
J9s (4)
Jc8c (1)
9c8c-8c7c (2)
which makes a total of 57 or 63% of his range, which gives me fold-equity of
0.37*36 = 13.32
Interisting enough VILLAIN seemed to 3bet in usually reasonable big sizes, despite his normal min-betting practice. So I would fold against a 3bet, which should occur 10% of the time with 9 combos. Against his calling range, which consists of 53% of his range with 48 combos I have about 35% equity. So the EV of my raise sums up to:
13.32 + 0.10*0 + 0.53*0.35*94 - 30 = 0.76
The bluff raise here indeed still has slightly positive EV. As an EV of less then 1 SB isn‘t really overwhelming, I should compare this to the EV of calling instead:
With his min-bet my opponent offers me pot-odds of 17:1 or 5.56%. If we assume the very likely case, that he also will min-bet the remaining streets, such that I would have to continue calling him down till showdown, this changes to 19:3 or 14%. With 42.54% equity against his range, the call should still be well +EV. Precisely:
0.4254*46 - 6 = 13.57
If we compare this number to the EV of the bluff-raise, we figure a difference of 12.81 !
My agressive play in this spot did cost me almost 6.5 BB!!!!!!!!!!
Spoiler
Some additional thoughts:
As by no means it can be considered normal to have an opponent who min-bets on every street, I will just out of interest redo both calculations assuming, that VILLAIN would have used 1/2-pot-sized bets instead of min-bets. While keeping everything else unchanged.
This indeed is a bit unrealistic, as it definitely would narrow down his betting range OTF. Nevertheless we should give it a try. After all there are also a lot of guys out there who almost 100% cbet the flop. (I actually have a close friend... :f_rolleyes:)
In the bluff-raise scenario he would have bet 17, while I could have raised to 3x, i.e. 51. We are getting an EV of:
0.37*(34 + 17) + 0.10*0 + 0.53*0.35*(34 + 2*51) - 51 = - 6.90
So even without his more narrow range, this wouldn‘t have been viable.
Calling down all three streets would have given us an EV of:
0.4254*34*2^2 - 51 = 6.85
Also in this modified scenario calling would have been the much more viable option. Although probably not as good as it seems, as we didn‘t consider his more narrow range and the fact, that my hand gets a lot of it‘s equity from potential scare cards, which could stop VILLAINS action on future streets. So it is very well possible, that folding would be the best option in a situation like this.
So now as it is established, that my flop decision was already -EV and this case starts to become fatiguing, I will skip the evaluation of my turn decision and move as fast to the river as possible to calculate the EV of my glorious jam.
The turn brings J♣, which completes my straight as well as potential flush-draws. He might have called my turn-bet with:
Spoiler
QQ 1/3 of the time (1)
JJ (3)
AK 4 of 9 combos (4)
AcQc (1)
Ac8c-Ac2c (7)
K8s (2)
Q9s (3)
9c8c-8c7c (2)
On the river, 3♠, I am ahead of this range with 52.17% equity. Thanks to his min-bet, calling him would be massive +EV with
0.5217*244 - 2 = 125.29
Instead I chose to jam here. If we assume, that he folds his last combo of QQ as well as half of his remaining AK combos, this would make 13% of his range, while I would get 47.37% equity against the range he is calling with. As the effective stack-size was only 80 at this spot, this sums up to an EV of:
0.13*322 + 0.78*0.4737*402 - 80 = 110.39
So jamming instead of calling yielded me an EV loss of
110.39 – 125.29 = - 14.90 = - 7.5 BB
I don‘t know exactly how it is calculated, but I guess that the jam also contributed several more BB of rake compared to the call, which would have made it even worse.
I am still uncertain about the theory here. I might be confusing some things. I wonder how my betting range on the flop really should have looked like. My actual hand already seemed to be one of the better bluffs and it still most likely wasn't the right decision to bet with it.
If some knowing person could explain to me, how the theory of a balanced betting range could have been applied in this spot or how my betting range ideally could have looked like, it would indeed be to my utmost joy!
thoughts on whip-lash #2
This stuff is exhausting! Maybe I am also a bit too acribic with these reviews. But one shouldn‘t anger the heavens and I still feel the sinister grasp of the demons of blunder tightening around my soul. This hand actually wasn‘t as bad as I initially thought. The less agressive action would have been of course much better then what I actually did, but in the end it wasn‘t as blundersome as a lot of my other performances. According to my initial plan, there are still four more whip-lashes to go before I can revisit the tables. I might send a prayer to the gods tonight, bidding for forgiveness and for the allowance to return to the tables earlier, as my repentantness should be already out of question now. I am confident that the heavens will show grace with the poor sinner who I am.
Critique and further hints are welcome as always!
(If anybody at all can be bothered to read all this shit)
May the heavens keep their benevolent eye on you guys!