Great to see you back Kyyberi! Off topic what are some of your other hobbies besides poker it'd be interesting to know?
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Btw, Kyyberi, which exactly genres of metal(core) do you prefer to listen to? 
(I think I'm gonna sell my soul to thrash 
)
I practise and teach taekwondo. I played american football for years but now I am doing live streams from our games and work as a media representative. And I play guitar.
For music, I do like anything with a melody. I love metal too, and if I had to pick just one band at the moment it would be Arch Enemy. But I am 80's kid so Anthrax ftw!
Originally posted by Kyyberi
I practise and teach taekwondo. I played american football for years.......
Aw, so: Don´t make Kyyberi mad? 
You can't make me mad ♦ I worked over 10 years in kindergarten and now at child welfare (or child protection). So the only way to make me mad is to call flop with air, call turn with 1 outer and make it on the river when I have the 2nd nuts. No other way. 
Or Prim style, full pot flop with air, full pot one-outer on turn and full pot when hitting one outer ;-)
Originally posted by Kyyberi
You can't make me mad ♦ I worked over 10 years in kindergarten and now at child welfare (or child protection). So the only way to make me mad is to call flop with air, call turn with 1 outer and make it on the river when I have the 2nd nuts. No other way.
With your (!) coaching it´s impossible to do that ♠_cool:♠_wink:
Originally posted by deralte71
Or Prim style, full pot flop with air, full pot one-outer on turn and full pot when hitting one outer
Now I have played three sessions of Fusion at 0.2/0.5 limit. I don't even know what it's abbreviation should be? 100bb is $5, but the buy-in is $3. So is it F3? F5? FPLO? PLOF? FUS?
Anyway, the single biggest thing at that limit is value. Second is value. Third is value. And that's it.
Here is my list of wonders:
- People call with Jxxx on KKKJx board on the river.
- People call multiple streets with 2 pairs on flushing boards
- People call pot sized bets and raises with air, without any obvious backdoors
- Sometimes people 3bet preflop with weird hands, and then shove flops when they totally miss it
Two factors to understand:
1) There are more Holdem players than PLO players, so they play Turn/River like in Holdem.
As Turn and River are PLO, they tend to overplay overpairs and medium strength hands. In betting, raising and calling. Also their sizings are confusing for PLO player. In PLO you don't see 1/4 pot bets with nut straight on flush draw board. In Holdem I guess you don't have to protect your hand that much, but in PLO it's crucial. And come on, 1/4 sizing gives direct +EV odds to even a bare flush draw.
2) No one knows anything about anything
Just like when Holdem player goes to PLO table without any preparation, he is totally lost about ranges. He knows that AAxx is a good hand, but that's it. KK might be. Same in Fusion. Everyone knows that AA is favorite if you get it in preflop. After that, everything is open. My experience is that Holdem players in general are pretty bad in estimating outs (especially when they have more than 2 cards), equities, pot odds and implied odds. When you add that third and fourth hole card, they have no idea about drawing math. And in Fusion, as your total air can turn to nuts on the next street, FE is often pretty low. Some people are scared to bet the nuts on the flop, or they slow play it. Both are bad options.
Out of those two comes the simple strategy advice: don't bluff.
There are some exceptions. In HU pots, turns and rivers are good for bluffing on certain boards, and some flops are good for bluffing unless the opponent is one of those players that call the flop with anything cos he might hit the jackpot on the turn. On Turn I do a lot of semibluffing. The hand is defined, and there is only one card to come. The difference between Flop and Turn FE is huge. So your EV of drawing hands go up a lot by semibluffing.
Putting opponent on a range when they call or bet is somewhat impossible. In PLO you can narrow down the range from the bottom and from the top. In Fusion you can't as his flopped air can become nuts on the turn, no matter what the turn card on the table is. I have seen people raise flops with weird hands, the overall raising range has been from air to nuts and everything in between. People overplay overpairs all the time, or they shove hands like bottom end gutshot with 7high flush draw (that might be a "monster draw" in Holdem). But one thing is for sure: River raises are for value. River bets and raises in multiway pots are quite often strong hands.
Fusion is so much fun that I am thinking about playing it in the next Primetime coaching at 17th day.
P.S. What might be good stuff to have in the HUD for Fusion?
Originally posted by Kyyberi
Fusion is so much fun that I am thinking about playing it in the next Primetime coaching at 17th day.
You might be too late because it looks as though Six Plus Holdem will be launched at Stars on the 16th and take a lot of customers out of Fusion. (It's not known whether trips will beat straights in Stars' version of the rules like they do on the iPoker network, but flushes will definitely beat full houses.)
Skipped Fusion today, played some Zoom PLO (I know Zoom is usually a bad option for EV, but I was in a situation where I don't know how long I can play and I was on my laptop. Excuses, excuses). Breakeven session in EV, there were few crazy players who just decided to get lucky. In one hand, shortie opened, aggro player 3bet, I 4bet with AA, shortie shoves which didn't open new betting round. Aggro calls and I call. On the flop pot is over $50 and I have $5 behind. Aggro bets that $5 on Q92 flop. He had Q993. Shortie had KT72. 300bb pot. Well played Q993 
Here are two highlight hands from the session:
Spoiler
Hero (BTN): 337.24 BB
SB: 166.24 BB (VPIP: 34.78, PFR: 13.04, 3Bet Preflop: 10.00, Hands: 46)
BB: 101.4 BB (VPIP: 30.61, PFR: 26.53, 3Bet Preflop: 20.00, Hands: 50)
UTG: 145.52 BB (VPIP: 30.43, PFR: 21.74, 3Bet Preflop: 5.56, Hands: 47)
MP: 102.76 BB (VPIP: 26.83, PFR: 18.29, 3Bet Preflop: 5.17, Hands: 168)
CO: 363.24 BB (VPIP: 20.00, PFR: 15.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 41)
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has A♥ K♠ 2♠ 3♥
fold, MP raises to 3.4 BB, fold, Hero calls 3.4 BB, fold, BB raises to 14 BB, MP calls 10.6 BB, Hero calls 10.6 BB
BB had 3bet 1/5 so far, and that one hand was Aces. But otherwise he looks like he might be a standard reg, so can't fold there with a caller and position.
Flop: (42.4 BB, 3 players) A♦ 6♥ K♣
BB bets 20.32 BB, fold, Hero calls 20.32 BB
Good or bad flop, depending if he has Aces or not. He thought only couple of seconds, which might mean it's automatic cbet for his strategy on that board, or he doesn't have AAxx. If I had AA there 3way oop, I would think for few seconds about the sizing. Anyway, can't fold top2 so can't do anything else than call.
Turn: (83.04 BB, 2 players) K♦
BB bets 22 BB, Hero calls 22 BB
Turn is like the flop, except that if he doesn't have AAxx he has 0% equity to win. Weird sizing, he has 67bb behind. If he was betting for value, wouldn't he usually bet at least a bit more? As on the flop, hero has no other options than to call. Folding is not an option and raise doesn't achieve anything.
River: (127.04 BB, 2 players) 3♠
BB bets 45.08 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 45.08 BB
Then he shoves, hero calls and he shows AQ. My first thought was that he should earn some kind of an award for his optimism. In 3bet pot, I call flop and turn. It should be obvious that I have either an Ace or a King. And once he shoves I have to pay 45 into a pot of 210 so I am not folding anything.
But his line with AQ is interesting. I think flop bet is fine. On the turn it's tricky. Is that bet for a value or a bluff? Flop was rainbow, so when I call I really should have Ax or QJTx. If I don't have Kxxx then AQ can bet for value. Maybe he was going to bet-fold, but when I just called he thought I don't have a King and shoved river for value.
So from the initial thought that opponent played his hand badly, I turned to think that his line with AQ actually makes a lot of sense. If I had a weaker Ace then his line would have been brilliant.
BB shows A♣ 9♥ 8♥ Q♣ (Two Pair, Aces and Kings)
(Pre 49%, Flop 12%, Turn 0%)
Hero shows A♥ K♠ 2♠ 3♥ (Full House, Kings full of Aces)
(Pre 51%, Flop 88%, Turn 100%)
Hero wins 209.2 BB
Spoiler
Hero (BTN): 100 BB
SB: 104.76 BB (VPIP: 72.55, PFR: 47.06, 3Bet Preflop: 16.67, Hands: 52)
BB: 212.96 BB (VPIP: 15.38, PFR: 7.69, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 14)
UTG: 137.84 BB (VPIP: 34.04, PFR: 12.77, 3Bet Preflop: 9.52, Hands: 47)
MP: 97.8 BB (VPIP: 30.77, PFR: 15.38, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 13)
CO: 95.6 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 16.67, 3Bet Preflop: 25.00, Hands: 12)
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has 6♦ 9♥ 7♣ 5♦
UTG raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, Hero calls 3 BB, SB calls 2.6 BB, BB calls 2 BB
UTG opens and hero makes a loose call on the button. Perhaps too loose, but UTG was really tight one so his range is almost exclusively broadway cards. He also is tight postflop, giving hero a lot of room to make bluffs. But then both blinds call and it just sucks. And if hero had looked his HUD, he would have seen that SB is an aggro-baller. Bad call preflop, bad bad bad!
Flop: (12 BB, 4 players) 7♠ A♠ 4♠
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks
Alright folks, nothing to see here!
Turn: (12 BB, 4 players) 6♣
SB bets 5.76 BB, fold, fold, Hero calls 5.76 BB
Aggro leads half a pot after everyone checked flop. Classical spot to bluff, although I wouldn't do it 4 ways. Hero has 2 pairs and a gutshot, and the sizing is weird in multiway pot.
River: (23.52 BB, 2 players) Q♠
SB bets 12 BB, Hero calls 12 BB
River is another spade, and opponent bets half a pot. Didn't think almost at all, it was a quick bet. That bet should be a polarizing one, meaning it's nuts or air. Jhigh flush can be played that way too. But all of his middle flushes, straights, sets etc. he should check. So if hero is right about the bet being polarizing, then 2pairs should be as good as a straight. Hero call, and it paid off.
Problem in the call is that sometimes opponent shows higher 2pairs and hero is left thinking why in the world opponent bet those. But when the assumption is right, it looks sooooooo nice. And I am sure the opponent said few selected words after seeing that hero called his double barrel with 67xx.
SB shows J♣ J♠ 3♣ K♥ (One Pair, Jacks)
(Pre 55%, Flop 40%, Turn 20%)
Hero shows 6♦ 9♥ 7♣ 5♦ (Two Pair, Sevens and Sixes)
(Pre 45%, Flop 60%, Turn 80%)
Hero wins 45.52 BB
As the idea of using avg ranking for a starting hand in Fusion didn't work out, I had a new idea. We can practice starting hands in normal PLO with Odds Oracle by asking "how often a hand matches range of XX". And XX is PokerJuice preflop range, like First In 15%. Now with Fusion, if I put just two cards (the starting hand) and ask how often it is in FI15, I get a % number. Like JT is 30-32%.
Now the harder part is to figure out a treshold. Let's say we want to open 30% from CO (although I am not sure what would be GTO in Fusion where postflop position is more important than in PLO and equity shifts are HUGE at flop and turn). Do we want to open just top 30% of hands (that would be the same as top30% in Holdem) or do we tweak the range a little? Ace in general can make a strong hand, so are low Ax hands better than J9?
Now as I thought it more, the % how often something is at certain range doesn't really help a lot. It gives same results as just looking at Holdem ranking of the hand. But I don't want to delete it, maybe it will give some ideas to someone.
Another question that I have been wondering is this: how wide we can call in position? Equities run so close and position is so powerful that shouldn't we peel a lot of flops from the Button? In PLO general rule is that we don't make much money by calling. But now when no one can put you on range when we go from Flop to Turn (as flop air can be nuts on the turn) you can make more bluffs than in normal Holdem/PLO. Which increases the EV of those crappy hands.
And then they killed Fusion.
Back to PLO then, I just noticed that I need a new mouse pad. My mouse wasn't working smoothly, and when I have 12 tables open some of the buttons are really small. So I bought a new mouse. Still not smooth enough, so the reason might be my 14 year old mouse pad.
Hand of the day, solid ranges FTW!
Spoiler
BTN: 68 BB (VPIP: 66.67, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 3)
SB: 48.6 BB
BB: 41.84 BB (VPIP: 41.67, PFR: 9.72, 3Bet Preflop: 4.92, Hands: 146)
UTG: 120.48 BB (VPIP: 40.00, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 5)
Hero (MP): 104.96 BB
CO: 40.64 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: -, Hands: 1)
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has Q♦ Q♥ 5♣ A♣
fold, Hero raises to 3.4 BB, fold, BTN calls 3.4 BB, SB raises to 14.6 BB, fold, Hero raises to 48.2 BB, BTN calls 44.8 BB, SB raises to 48.6 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 0.4 BB, BTN calls 0.4 BB
SB is a shorty and although there aren't stats from him I know that he is often gambling there with wider range. I block AA so I am happy to flip with him and knock the BTN out.
Flop: (146.8 BB, 3 players) Q♣ J♥ 8♦
Hero bets 56.36 BB and is all-in, BTN calls 19.4 BB and is all-in
Turn: (185.6 BB, 3 players) K♠
River: (185.6 BB, 3 players) 6♠
Hero shows Q♦ Q♥ 5♣ A♣ (Three of a Kind, Queens)
Main Pot [146.8 BB]: (Pre 28%, Flop 77%, Turn 89%)
Side Pot#1 [38.8 BB]: (Pre 56%, Flop 94%, Turn 100%)
BTN shows 6♦ 4♣ 3♦ 3♣ (One Pair, Sixes)
I almost fell from my chair when I saw this hand. I get the first preflop call, he is VPIP 67. But then after 3bet and 4bet, 6433 isn't that great. But hey, VPIP 67 so why not see the flop. And then he puts 20bb more on the flop. He has 2 backdoor flush draws, so it's not horrible. But as he has 20bb behind to over 180bb pot, why not just get it in preflop. I don't think he would have folded to any flop.
Main Pot [146.8 BB]: (Pre 33%, Flop 5%, Turn 0%)
Side Pot#1 [38.8 BB]: (Pre 44%, Flop 6%, Turn 0%)
SB shows 7♠ Q♠ A♥ K♥ (Two Pair, Kings and Queens)
Main Pot [146.8 BB]: (Pre 38%, Flop 17%, Turn 11%)
Hero wins 177.72 BB
Sorry for dragging you into Fusion, I honestly didn't expect it to be killed so soon.
RIP, Fusion, you'll be missed 
Short session, and one of those...
Spoiler
Nothing special, just your everyday one outers (well not 1 outer, he had couple Tens too)
Spoiler
BTN: 86 BB (VPIP: 40.00, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 9.52, Hands: 45)
SB: 138.32 BB
BB: 152.28 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 22.22, 3Bet Preflop: 12.50, Hands: 19)
UTG: 179.24 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 25.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 4)
Hero (MP): 125.24 BB
CO: 83.16 BB (VPIP: 20.90, PFR: 8.96, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 68)
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has 8♠ 8♥ 7♠ 7♣
UTG raises to 3.4 BB, Hero raises to 11.6 BB, fold, fold, fold, BB raises to 38.6 BB, UTG calls 35.2 BB, Hero calls 27 BB
Flop: (116.2 BB, 3 players) T♦ T♣ 7♦
BB bets 111.28 BB, fold, Hero calls 86.64 BB and is all-in
Turn: (289.48 BB, 2 players) A♠
River: (289.48 BB, 2 players) 4♦
BB shows 2♥ A♦ 5♣ A♣ (Full House, Aces full of Tens)
(Pre 57%, Flop 18%, Turn 98%)
Hero shows 8♠ 8♥ 7♠ 7♣ (Full House, Sevens full of Tens)
(Pre 43%, Flop 82%, Turn 3%)
BB wins 281.48 BB
Nothing special, just your everyday flop raise-bluff in 3bet pot with total air vs. my nuts.
Spoiler
Hero (BTN): 100 BB
SB: 114.04 BB (VPIP: 27.59, PFR: 20.69, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 31)
BB: 86.76 BB (VPIP: 24.79, PFR: 14.02, 3Bet Preflop: 5.98, Hands: 2,646)
UTG: 73.24 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 33.33, 3Bet Preflop: 25.00, Hands: 7)
MP: 102.2 BB (VPIP: 29.17, PFR: 19.17, 3Bet Preflop: 6.25, Hands: 121)
CO: 320.88 BB (VPIP: 100.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 1)
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has 6♣ A♠ A♣ 8♠
fold, fold, CO raises to 3 BB, Hero raises to 10.4 BB, fold, fold, CO calls 7.4 BB
Flop: (22.2 BB, 2 players) 2♥ A♦ 8♣
CO checks, Hero bets 8 BB, CO raises to 26.64 BB, Hero calls 18.64 BB
Turn: (75.48 BB, 2 players) Q♠
CO checks, Hero bets 62.96 BB and is all-in, CO calls 62.96 BB
River: (201.4 BB, 2 players) 9♥
CO shows T♥ J♠ 4♦ J♦ (Straight, Queen High)
(Pre 35%, Flop 9%, Turn 20%)
Hero shows 6♣ A♠ A♣ 8♠ (Three of a Kind, Aces)
(Pre 65%, Flop 91%, Turn 80%)
CO wins 193.4 BB
Nothing special, just your everyday 4way all-in on the flop where one has decent draw, one has air and one has weak draw. Solid ranges FTW!
Spoiler
BTN: 213.84 BB (VPIP: 42.73, PFR: 29.63, 3Bet Preflop: 16.99, Hands: 929)
SB: 90.48 BB (VPIP: 44.44, PFR: 33.33, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 9)
Hero (BB): 125.96 BB
UTG: 100 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 2)
MP: 130.44 BB (VPIP: 30.77, PFR: 19.23, 3Bet Preflop: 3.85, Hands: 54)
CO: 92.92 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 25.00, Hands: 33)
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has 8♦ J♠ Q♠ 8♣
fold, fold, CO raises to 3.4 BB, BTN calls 3.4 BB, SB calls 3 BB, Hero calls 2.4 BB
Flop: (13.6 BB, 4 players) 8♠ T♣ 2♣
SB checks, Hero bets 13.04 BB, CO calls 13.04 BB, BTN raises to 65.2 BB, SB calls 65.2 BB, Hero raises to 122.56 BB and is all-in, CO calls 76.48 BB and is all-in, BTN raises to 179.92 BB, SB calls 21.88 BB and is all-in
Turn: (435.32 BB, 4 players) 3♦
River: (435.32 BB, 4 players) 6♠
Hero shows 8♦ J♠ Q♠ 8♣ (Three of a Kind, Eights)
Main Pot [361.92 BB]: (Pre 11%, Flop 45%, Turn 50%)
Side Pot#1 [7.32 BB]: (Pre 15%, Flop 57%, Turn 66%)
Side Pot#2 [66.08 BB]: (Pre 53%, Flop 66%, Turn 69%)
BTN shows 3♣ A♣ 4♠ 8♥ (Two Pair, Eights and Threes)
Main Pot [361.92 BB]: (Pre 28%, Flop 32%, Turn 31%)
Side Pot#1 [7.32 BB]: (Pre 31%, Flop 34%, Turn 31%)
Side Pot#2 [66.08 BB]: (Pre 47%, Flop 34%, Turn 31%)
CO shows Q♥ A♠ K♠ K♥ (One Pair, Kings)
Main Pot [361.92 BB]: (Pre 43%, Flop 9%, Turn 3%)
Side Pot#1 [7.32 BB]: (Pre 53%, Flop 9%, Turn 3%)
SB shows 9♣ 7♥ 9♥ Q♦ (Straight, Ten High)
Main Pot [361.92 BB]: (Pre 17%, Flop 14%, Turn 16%)
SB wins 353.92 BB
Hero wins 73.4 BB
It's not nice when that session happens at the same time you are taking a shot to higher stakes. Back to grinding.
Another session, and the trend continues. Good decisions, good spots, good outcomes, bad suckouts. At one point the difference was 10 buyins. It's normal in PLO, but as I said I am taking a shot to higher limit so it would be nice to rungood instead of that. I just started to wonder that normally you would like the graph to be that way, instead of switching orange and green lines. But when taking shots and trying to establish bankroll buffer to new limit, I wouldn't mind a little rungood. ♦
Spoiler
Couple of hands that caught my attention:
First, I haven't seen this kind of a bluff raise in a while. With those actions and those stacks. Opponent sort of instafolded, which means that he didn't have any kind of hand.
Spoiler
BTN: 191.76 BB (VPIP: 19.02, PFR: 9.24, 3Bet Preflop: 7.35, Hands: 188)
SB: 224.28 BB (VPIP: 19.66, PFR: 7.69, 3Bet Preflop: 3.77, Hands: 119)
BB: 100 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 32.50, 3Bet Preflop: 16.67, Hands: 40)
UTG: 202.92 BB (VPIP: 31.97, PFR: 20.95, 3Bet Preflop: 11.18, Hands: 1,403)
Hero (MP): 100 BB
CO: 79 BB (VPIP: 27.27, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 22)
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has 6♠ 9♣ A♠ 7♦
UTG raises to 3.4 BB, Hero calls 3.4 BB, fold, fold, fold, BB calls 2.4 BB
Flop: (10.6 BB, 3 players) A♣ 7♠ 9♥
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets 7.64 BB, fold, UTG calls 7.64 BB
Turn: (25.88 BB, 2 players) A♥
UTG checks, Hero bets 14 BB, UTG raises to 40.4 BB, Hero raises to 88.96 BB and is all-in, fold
UTG opens, and 3way check-calls flop. Then check-raises the turn. With air. Thinking that I don't have A or 77/99 there over 50% of times. A bit optimistic in my mind. He needs less than 25% to call there.
Hero wins 102.16 BB
Second, this is the sickest bluff catch so far in 2019 for me.
Spoiler
BTN: 176.12 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 16.67, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 7)
Hero (SB): 184.36 BB
BB: 67 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 25.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 20)
UTG: 108.96 BB (VPIP: 45.45, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
MP: 226.28 BB (VPIP: 28.95, PFR: 21.05, 3Bet Preflop: 6.67, Hands: 38)
CO: 37.24 BB (VPIP: 24.24, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 8.33, Hands: 34)
Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has J♦ 7♦ A♥ T♥
fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to 3.4 BB, Hero raises to 11.2 BB, fold, BTN calls 7.8 BB
BTN is relatively unknown, so a standard 3bet from SB.
Flop: (23.4 BB, 2 players) 4♣ K♥ J♥
Hero bets 16.8 BB, BTN calls 16.8 BB
NFD, nut gutshot and middle pair. We are deep, but still I think cbetting is better than check-calling.
Turn: (57 BB, 2 players) 5♦
Hero bets 40.92 BB, BTN calls 40.92 BB
He called the flop, so a big portion of his range is something less than 2 pairs. He might just call with KJ or even a set as we are deep and now raise the turn, but on the other hand the chance for that is a slim one. People usually play sets and top2 quite straightforward in 3bet pots. Turn bet is sort of a semibluff, as he still has Kxxx, QQTx kind of hands that are ahead of us. If he folds, nice. If he calls, we have a lot of outs.
River: (138.84 BB, 2 players) 8♦
Hero checks, BTN bets 107.2 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 107.2 BB
River is one of the nastiest cards in the deck. I checked because I really didn't know what to do there. I had bet flop and turn, so if I bet river what am I representing? Would I bet AA? KJ? I can't really have 67 unless I have something like AA76hh. On the other hand, if opponent has Kxxx or QQTx he beats me. And even now, I am not sure what would be the best line for the river. After I checked, he shoved 107bb quite quickly.
My first thought was WTF? as that didn't make any sense unless he had 67. So I went to the tank. And started to work on his range.
- If he had 67, he would need to have something along with that to hit the flop. BTN open, so he could have hand like 4567, K76x etc. But a quick shove? If I was there with 67 I would think for a sizing, as shove is pretty big and forces AA often to fold. But 67 is possible.
- If he had a set/2 pairs, would he shove? I could have KK/JJ and checked to call. Why turn 2 pairs into a bluff, when he can take the showdown? And with flop and turn calls, he would need to make the 2 pairs with an eight. So his possible 2 pairs would be sort of weak. And quick 107bb shove with J8 kind of hand? Weird.
- If he had Kxxx, could he turn it to a bluff? I think this was the part that concerns me the most. KQTx, losing to AA could bluff and beat me if I call.
- If he had a worse hand, could he shove 107bb as a bluff?
When I thought about calling, I started to think about my run in the session. Had been struggling to make profit, so would I want to risk over 100bb into a hero call with just a middle pair in 350bb pot? Well I erased that thought quickly from my mind, as I realized that it was a mental game fish thinking. I have talked earlier about my intuition in bluff catching. Sometimes I just have a feeling that opponent is bluffing although I don't know why. And I have learned to trust that intuition, it has been right so many times. Maybe some of you have seen that in my streams. Intuition is just the subconscious mind doing the work. And when I wondered his shove and erased the fishy thinking, I got the feeling that he is bluffing. And even then I was a bit nervous to press the call button, cos if he shows Kxxx it would suck.
But I was right, and I am sure the opponent gave me a huge fish label.
BTN shows 4♥ T♣ 9♥ 2♣ (One Pair, Fours)
(Pre 39%, Flop 20%, Turn 18%)
Hero shows J♦ 7♦ A♥ T♥ (One Pair, Jacks)
(Pre 61%, Flop 80%, Turn 83%)
Hero wins 345.24 BB
Omaha sure is weird game or thinking behind it at least. If you have value hand on flop and turn is this run out not one of best ones? No draw from flop has completed and one very unlikely backdoor straight completed. So if we shove river we can still easily have at least sets in our value range. KJ would be on thin side probably. Though in same way if villain has e.g. some Kxxx without heavily blocking your possible draw hands would he not have reasonable bluff catch candidate?
Same way if villain wants to bluff river he needs way more value combo than some very specific 67xx combo to have even tiny bit of balance (I would imagine). If he has just called twice with set those should be no brainers and probably KJ also. Though probably also those are limited somewhat to combos that have some draws as support because even sets are so vulnerable on this board. Of course if hero is never hero calling then KJ cannot be value hand but e.g. AA would seem like pretty solid call on this board with 1001 busted draws. Especially if we assume sets or KJ to rarely taking this line.
PS: This was for AJT7ds hand.
We don't have many KK/JJ hands in our 3bet oop range there. If we had KJ, I am not sure if we should bet or check-call the river.
Oh boy do those poker gods laugh at me! Another session, 6 buyins under EV. Here are all PLO hands from this year:
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On the bright side, orange line is looking good and I am not losing.
Couple of hands from today's session:
You can play Aces that way, for sure...
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MP: 104.88 BB (VPIP: 28.62, PFR: 12.22, 3Bet Preflop: 2.54, Hands: 319)
CO: 354.04 BB (VPIP: 49.64, PFR: 12.41, 3Bet Preflop: 5.97, Hands: 142)
BTN: 100 BB (VPIP: 21.90, PFR: 16.79, 3Bet Preflop: 8.89, Hands: 139)
SB: 100.4 BB (VPIP: 23.85, PFR: 16.51, 3Bet Preflop: 5.26, Hands: 112)
BB: 100 BB (VPIP: 31.46, PFR: 18.07, 3Bet Preflop: 8.11, Hands: 323)
Hero (UTG): 132.04 BB
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has 8♣ 8♠ 9♦ T♦
Hero raises to 3.4 BB, fold, fold, fold, fold, BB raises to 10.6 BB, Hero calls 7.2 BB
Flop: (21.6 BB, 2 players) 8♦ K♠ 7♥
BB checks, Hero bets 15.52 BB, BB calls 15.52 BB
Turn: (52.64 BB, 2 players) 4♥
BB checks, Hero bets 37.8 BB, BB raises to 73.88 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 36.08 BB
I just don't get the logic behind this line. And I see this a lot. If he loves hit AA+gutshot so much, why is he slowplaying it on the flop and then shove 1,5 pots on the turn?
The logic might bet something like this. Flop: "Can't fold AA, and I do have a straight draw", Turn: "Fuck it."
River: (200.4 BB, 2 players) 2♠
BB shows A♦ A♠ J♦ T♣ (One Pair, Aces)
(Pre 72%, Flop 22%, Turn 13%)
Hero shows 8♣ 8♠ 9♦ T♦ (Three of a Kind, Eights)
(Pre 28%, Flop 78%, Turn 88%)
Hero wins 192.4 BB
There's good aggression, and then there is this...
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UTG: 272.96 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 32)
Hero (CO): 100 BB
BTN: 83.84 BB (VPIP: 38.32, PFR: 10.28, 3Bet Preflop: 3.92, Hands: 108)
SB: 31.8 BB (VPIP: 29.54, PFR: 15.98, 3Bet Preflop: 4.40, Hands: 641)
BB: 100 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 14.86, 3Bet Preflop: 7.69, Hands: 74)
SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB
Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has 4♣ Q♦ J♦ 3♣
UTG calls 1 BB, Hero calls 1 BB, BTN raises to 5.4 BB, fold, fold, UTG calls 4.4 BB, Hero calls 4.4 BB
BTN is a bit weird player. Preflop stats are sort of a call-happy tight-reg. Calls preflop a bit too much, opens a bit too tight. Postflop does weird stuff. I have a feeling that he doesn't really have a standard strategy, he makes the decisions in a moment. Which means a lot of his decisions are based on a feeling. A bit harder to play against as he could take totally different lines in the same situations depending on his feelings. Maybe that is some sort of balance as he could do anything with anything.
Flop: (17.6 BB, 3 players) T♣ 3♠ K♠
UTG checks, Hero checks, BTN bets 8 BB, fold, Hero calls 8 BB
Just under half a pot cbet, which is one of those weird things. On that board it's a weird sizing. If he had bet bigger, I would have folded my OESD and bottom pair.
Turn: (33.6 BB, 2 players) 6♦
Hero checks, BTN checks
Total blank, and he checks behind.
River: (33.6 BB, 2 players) 3♥
Hero bets 16.08 BB, BTN raises to 70.44 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 54.36 BB
As he checked the Turn, trips is definitely a valuebet on the River. But then he shoves and I was first like WTF, that doesn't make sense at all. Didn't see that one coming. If he had KK/TT why would he check the Turn? He could, as he does weird stuff. But not sure if he is that crazy. As it was hard to put him on a value hand, and he can do really not-so-good-things-strategy-wise, I called and was really surprised to see AA. Was that a value shove or a bluff? And when I saw his hand, I just wondered that why did he shove it?
BTN shows 2♥ A♣ 9♣ A♥ (Two Pair, Aces and Threes)
(Pre 62%, Flop 48%, Turn 60%)
Hero shows 4♣ Q♦ J♦ 3♣ (Three of a Kind, Threes)
(Pre 38%, Flop 52%, Turn 40%)
Hero wins 167.08 BB