[PLO] One month journey to solver world

So cool, Kyyberi, look forward to June.

Very cool! Heeey, wanted to be the first post :f_cry::f_cry::f_cry:

But I´m the first who gives this blog a "like"

enjoy the beaches of spain looking forward to this thread

It´s gonna be interesting for sure. Hope, my brain won´t explode!

Don't play PLO but will still try to follow this, sounds like an interesting project. Also enjoy your vacation sir

I'm not sure you'll need solvers though. I mean, can't we reach GTO by thoughts alone ?(?(

Originally posted by TJtheTJ
Don't play PLO but will still try to follow this, sounds like an interesting project. Also enjoy your vacation sir

I'm not sure you'll need solvers though. I mean, can't we reach GTO by thoughts alone ?(?(

Yes we can and then we make 50 K from 50 $, beat all the GTO-players and take over the world. :sifflote::sifflote:

What would be a blog without humor?

Originally posted by Primrose6789
Yes we can and then we make 50 K from 50 $, beat all the GTO-players and take over the world. :sifflote::sifflote:

I'm in !!!

Wish you a nice vacation Kyyberi !!

Looking forward to this.

Was supposed to start working today, but I haven't got all the toys enabled yet.

I heard about Youtube deleting poker videos, what the ***** is that?

First thing that I am starting to work on is to see how much PokerJuice First In ranges differ from solver ranges. I know that for 3betting the ranges are very different, but for RFI I am not so sure.

edit: Going with some "normal" PLO today at 22 CEST at www.twitch.tv/kyyberi

Not sure how long it will last, but I am putting all the streams and much more to youtube: www.youtube.com/kyyberi

First one is already there.

Nice stream last Night 🙌

All (actually most, but almost all) streams are uploaded to Youtube, so you can find them there. Just go to youtube.com/kyyberi

Today we had PLO Visions quiz, and it was fun. Solver is a strange thing, and it is very clear that playing solver strategy is non-optimal at micros. PLO Visions thing lasted for about an hour, followed by some casual PLO live playing. Check the video here:

I started to explore preflop stuff too. I started from CO range, as in solver that is almost exactly 30% and in PokerJuice we have RFI 30%. For UTG and MP solver uses 18 and 22, and we have only 15, 20 and 25 in PokerJuice.

I chose to start with JTxx (single suited, no pair) hands, as that is probably at the bottom of RFI CO range. Solver puts the threshold to JT87. Yellow is raise-call and gray is fold (black is impossible to have):

In PokerJuice range the threshold is at JT86ss.

Let's go to small cards then, 87xx single suited. Solver looks like this:

In PokerJuice, threshold is at 8754, which is not "two boxes" wider than solver.

As both ranges have the same amount of total hand combinations in them, and PokerJuice seems to have a bit lower thresholds, where is solver wider than PokerJuice? I checked ATxx, and in there solver threshold for suited Ace is AT53. PokerJuice has it at AT54.

6543ss is always open in PokerJuice, never in solver.

And for the last, what about pocket pairs? Let's see QQxx, single suited:

These are from the "bad suit section", meaning that it's not suited to Queen. Threshold is at QQT3, where T3 is suited. At PokerJuice, threshold is at QQ92. When it goes to hands like QQ65, PokerJuice range is once again one box wider than solver.

I am quite sure that if I went though all the hands and thresholds, the difference would be marginal at most. Remember that the hands at thresholds are close to EV0. Solver calculates the EV of each RFI hands versus the solver strategy, and those who have even the smalles +EV in them after the rake, are opening hands. So the ones in thresholds might have +0,01bb per hand EV, when played perfectly (against another solver strategy). And the hands outside the threshold might have EV -0,01bb. In reality, there are so many other things affecting the real EV of a hand that it doesn't make a difference if your threshold is at AT52 or AT53.

I am quite confident in saying that you can use PokerJuice ranges to practice your RFI, if you don't have the access to PLO Matrix or other solver ranges softwares. In most hands, PokerJuice threshold is marginally lower. I haven't yet found where solver turns to wider threshold (as it should even it out somewhere), maybe someone can give a hint?

Sometimes you win, sometimes you don't. But in this hand I would have liked to win, nice equity 3way with a draw. Almost 350bb pot.

Just finished looking in Mastermind a section called "Escape the Micros". I am quite happy to see that Jnandez has almost the same things to say there that I have been saying for years. The only thing that is different is cbet oop.

Solver wants to cbet roughly 20%. So does Jnandez. And I get the reasons. And I kinda agree with them:
- being oop in high SPR gives advantage to opp in position
- starting with check, and c-raising strong hands we lower the SPR, taking away the positional advantage
- high cbet freq weakens your check range a lot, and puts you in many turn spots with weak hands

I have used to teach for beginners to cbet a lot oop for starters, because:
- betting always lowers the SPR, taking away some positional advantage
- cbetting creates instant profit situation on most flops
- betting the flop gives more leverage for turn barrels
- it is easier to learn simple strategy than more complicated one

I am quite sure that one can make money with both strategies. And both can lead to huge problems with bad execution. Like in Jnandez strategy, if you don't check-raise and check-call with right ranges, you will probably easily check-fold too much, and then check-call too much. And going to turn with passive line and capped range will generate hard spots. And in my strategy, you will have many turns where you have a weak hand. And if you play turns passively or according to your hand strength, you end up folding often and bleeding the money away.

This is my hands from this year, where I open preflop (no 3bet+ pot), get to HU flop oop and cbet (frequency 76%):

When I check, I lose money as those are the situations where the board is not good for cbetting and I don't hit it. When I check, I face a bet around 40% of times.

So now I am wondering, should I go and try to build up HU oop game where I check most of the hands for starters. Might be fun, problem is that it would be really hard to play something else that I am very used to and works. And as I am playing often in RIO, I won't have hand histories to see the results. Maybe I should try to play more at PartyPoker, but to grind thousands of hands there will be really hard.

And even if I get good results with check-style, should I
A) change it?
B) start to teach it to beginners?

One thing is that the overly aggressive style works at PLO25 and lower, but would backfire a lot at PLO50+. If the aim is to go PLO50+, then it would be better to learn a style that doesn't need to be changed dramatically. But to learn that style, it requires quite a lot. One has to understand a lot about ranges and equities. Cos checking the flop will generate more hard spots than aggressive style. In aggressive style you just have to learn what boards we don't want to cbet (easy), and what turns we can barrel with high frequency (somewhat easy).

This is something that I will definitely get into.

Good luck on your study/enhancement!

I'd like to learn playing PLO, eventually.
I just don't know if I would survive to its swings. I can barely handle NL swings...

Late night stream coming up! Looking to start at 22.30 CEST. Link to stream

Such a nice stream Yesterday, awesome

It was. And too bad all the nice stuff about range definition doesn't go up to Youtube, because I forgot to press record.

And Nice with the 7th winning session in a row. Some of Nutraisins run pure finally rubs off🤗