[Closed] 66 in SB vs BB

i play SH very rarely, but do u really think villian will shove AQ and 88-TT?
AQs maybe, JJ+ maybe, but AQo and 88 is way too loose imo.

and yeah, its an oddscall. if u dont want to go broke preflop with yout pp, fold to his 3bet.

ok lets make it not so lose

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 33.136% 32.94% 00.19% 169220244 996228.00 { 66 }
Hand 1: 66.864% 66.67% 00.19% 342478500 996228.00 { TT+, AQs+, AKo }

still oddscall.....

u must think not about calling but about "why do u 4bet him"
4 bet bluff vs unknown is not a good think plus u make it huge (4bets could be 2.2-2.5x)
bad play imho.
And i dont get at all why standart unknown on nl100 must have 88 and AQ in his shoving range with no agro history.

4betsize really doesnt matter at all in this spot. Because you are always 4bet/calling.

His shoving range is probably 88+ AJs+ AQo+ and maybe some random bluff combo's. So def call.

I agree that you shouldnt 4bet him but call his 3bet and play post-flop

Because you are always 4bet/calling

why?

agree that you shouldnt 4bet him but call his 3bet and play post-flop

call 3bet op w 66? R u kidding? And what flop you want to see expt of 6x?

i think calling this 3bet is impossible
folding against unknown should be standard play i guess.
but in SB vs BB players tend to push / reraise much loser.

why i 4bet here ?

because i want to defend my SB raises and i try to find a blanced line when to 4bet and when not.

and the idea of 4betting small / folding....
this idea might work good in BU agsinst blinds because you have position if you get called, so smaller 4bets work quite good because they cant call oop.
but here BB would be IP so he might call with some better odds and position.

i totally agree that folding should be standard play. but if i want to 4bet it has to be big enough to deny good odds. if i reraise to 25 lets say, he gets 36:14 or 2,8:1 to call + position. i think this might give him just the feeling he can call.

so against unkown folding > 4betting > calling

what about shoving all in preflop against lag players here ?

Come on, we are not playing as a total fish so with a bit of post-flop skills you should be able to play the hand +ev.

We are always 4bet/calling because your equity vs his range is (oponnent depending obv but we are talking about regs right...) always +ev.

Shoving the 3bet is something which is quite risky but is very good for your image. He will call you with a polarized range, BUT he will stop bullying your SB openraises.

I dont like 4betting small OOP because as grummeler said. He could call and our spot is just supergross.

i dont think we have a big chance to play 66 oop in a 3bet pot without good reads on opponent in a way it is +ev.
i mean if we only play when we hit a set its impossible.
so wee need some spots where we bluff or make weak c/c moves oop.
and i dont like to do this against relativ unknown

Upfff (((
1st of all about raising big - what odds and position u mean of when we are speaking of 4bets???? They dont have any odds and implieds with marginal hands anyway. OP, IP, suited, unsuited, 2.5x raise, 3x, 4x - it just doesnt matter already in 100bb stacks when we are facing 4bet.
So when we have AA we dont want him to fold so raise not big. And with 68 we want our bluffs cost less.

Come on, we are not playing as a total fish so with a bit of post-flop skills you should be able to play the hand +ev.

Could you plz post some hands with links on some HH hosting where you called 3b w 66 op vs unknown. I play poker 2 years and i just cant believe it could be +ev at all.

We are always 4bet/calling because your equity vs his range is (oponnent depending obv but we are talking about regs right...) always +ev.

and when 4b\bluffing too??

i agree with that if he is a regular it should not matter at all if i 4bet like 26-28 or if i raise to 36.
but here its unknown and to him it might matter.
we dont know that, and when in doubt i like to give them weaker odds.
true he does not have impleid odds because we are only 100BB deep.

i totally agree with #2 and #3

If you wanna get it in then 4bet shoving is totally best.
Just do it in this spot with 55-JJ against him and you will most likely have profit against almost everyone in this situation (sb v bb). 5betbluffing is not so common, however he could shove over your 4bet with AQ and AJ and other smallish pockets which beat yours. This is really bad for your equity (since you have less F.E) so if you fold out these hands with a shove (AQ might still call) you win a lot. In general, if you wanna stick it in with a small pocket you want to be the one making the last move not the one making the call
Note that you don't have to think about balance at all in this spot against unknown.

That said folding isn't superbad against unknown I do however think calling is pretty bad, sorry Hannes, but I really doubt you're gonna play 66 profitably in a 3bet pot oop

I would definitely not 4bet preflop, against an unknown a fold is by far the best option imo.
A 4bet/call is definitely spewy: You're right, once you 4bet you can call due to the odds, but in general he is most likely not 3betbluffing often enough to make the 4bet/call +EV in itself.

Even IP we couldn't call the 3bet because he is unknown and we don't know about his cbetting tendencies, how often he 2ndbarrels etc.

In this spot there's just nothing you can do but folding to the 3bet.

Originally posted by grummeler

opponent is relativ unknown. only 12 hands here so no reads.
his 3bet range might be very wide here so i decided to make a 4bet and oop its 3x his 3bet to not give him good odds.

---> ♦ this part has not the smallest of logic tbh , but once u 4bet (let the reason be u feel for "666" ♦) its a call. r/4bet/f would be sligtly more ridiculous vs unknown than this thats for sure