Originally posted by Berzerger
Originally posted by Alferg
No, the simplest and most easily understandable explanation is usually correct.
In this case that is atheism.Funny, some time ago the simplest and easiest to understand explanation was that God created everything.
We've learnt a lot in 2000 years.
Responsibility for having no answer?
Exactly! You don't have a clue don't invent an answer so that you'll be feeling better by lying to yourself.
My purpose in life is whatever purpose i set for myself, since i feel nothing matters anyway. Strange as it may seem, sometimes the very idea that makes me do something challenging is that it really doesn't matter. So i guess i'm a nihilistic atheist... Lol.
However, I can accept religious people even though I cannot understand their belief
Think about how good would you feel knowing somebody is taking care of you, loves you, forgives you if you do something bad, sends you to heaven, blablabla... How good are you feeling knowing you have to be responsible for everything and when you die that's it you'll go in coffin not heaven?!?
Poker players that study like on pokerstrategy.com -> Thinking people who explain things with logic -> alot of atheists
Those 2 vids were hilarious btw
Originally posted by Berzerger"Truth is rarely pure and never simple." - Oscar Wilde
The reasoning only holds if you want it to. It implies that there are no other options than the ones mentioned. For example, if god is able to prevent evil, but not willing, it doesn't make him malevolent, it makes him apathetic. The entire text relies on the fact that if an omnipotent deity does exist, it inevitably pays attention to humans and cares for them, which I find one of the most arrogant assumptions man ever made.
I'm simply holding it against the religious dogma that God created us to his image and cares for us.
But I do agree that, like everything else in philosophy, you can look however you want and say that I've ordered two cheeseburgers with a coke in a funky way.
Anyway, I'm sure it would be a long and interesting conversation but, apart from the occasional motivational, I usually try to avoid this topic on the web.
Nicely put anyway 
Originally posted by silent21
@degreThe problem is that no one can say what is good and what is bad. There are rules set by "god" but if he doesnt exist then we come to the conclusion that we dont know what is good and bad.
Personally i dont believe in a divine being that is there to keep an eye on us. Maybe we are created by aliens, some supreme being but it is not the "god" described in the religions on the earth.
Exception is probably some of the asian religions which teach ppl that god is in us.
Just remember that the answer is 42.
I believe in the Poker Gods
... there is the Nuts God, he is one of the best ♦
then there is the BadBeat God, the nasty one, don't want to have him on your head, but you can't avoid him because he is nosy.
also the ugly one that you want to avoid as much as possible, he is the Downswing God, damn we all hate him ♠_biggrin:
The there is the beautiful Upswing Goddess, or Goddess of Heat how she was called in ancient times, now referred as Heater.
The Logical God of Odds & Outs, and there are a lot more, be here at our next class students 
we will talk about them then.
Anyway, I can't really call myself an full atheist... i found out that there is a word for it, it's called agnostic .... basically I'm saying "I Don't Really Care".
But I do partly believe in God, but not as a "man in the sky", but as in nature and universe. Basically in my view God is the laws of nature, the species.
I once heard somewhere this "The individual doesn't control the species, the species controls the individual" This explains everything man do. They see people killing a lot without consensus, they feel threatened and the urge to build a system, something to stop that as it's a menace for him and his species. They want something, they write a book where they say that it's bad to that, it's good to that, if you listen you'll be rewarded, if you don't you will be punished. If you do everything it's said there you'll go in a very nice place after you're gone, you'll gone in a very ugly place if you don't listen.
This common religions of our times are here and lasted longer than any other (Think about Zeus and the other gods of Olympus, there were times when people really believed they existed and were capable to sustain their belief. Think about how many stories/fables Greek mythology has, and people really believed them in those times; and other, Egyptian gods, etc.) ok, our religions resisted so much because they implemented a lot of smart things (probably from intuition):
- don't put the name of God under question
- don't have other gods (this is a silly one in my view, if there is only ONE God, how can you believe in another one? If you say that "that you can call "gods" those who you believe in without being real, as the sun, or a statue" than that would actually be the definition of a God, something you believe in that's not really there)
- if you listen to me you will be rewarded, not now, after you're dead
- if you don't you'll be punished for eternity, also after you're dead
- if a good thing happens to you, than that was the will of God, he loves you
- if a bad thing happens to you, than that was the will of God, he puts you to the test
- God will never show, if you believe in him he will be there spiritually
Spirituality is good. Even religion sometimes, as long as it's not stopping you from doing and accomplishing whatever you want in life.
Btw, as an offtopic, a famous man said (don't remember the name) "It's not religion that chains us, but conventional wisdom"
"Conventional wisdom" meaning doing what everybody says it's normal to do: finish school, get a job, get a wife/husband, have babies, work till pension, be old, die. This is one line of it. Conventional wisdom it's actually only conventional. Basically you should do whatever you want, not what somebody else tells you should.
That's why I live by this words:
Life is a great adventure or nothing!
Originally posted by Hahaownedlolz
Poker players that study like on pokerstrategy.com -> Thinking people who explain things with logic -> alot of atheistsThose 2 vids were hilarious btw
That was my thoughtproces too making this thread I just wanted to see I was right making this assumption or that there where still a lot of people that use logical thought in poker but choose not to use that way of thinking when with religion ( or the lack there of with most athiest )
I believe, there is something created everything we sense. Some call it God, some Allah, some Ra etc. In my opinion for given time frame if some rule is not causing chaos then it can be assumed that it's good. This rule maybe needed to change/improved or get rid of it entirely with the needs of majority. Very few people will benefit from living in a chaotic system.
There is one thing that all religious people have in common - they are all capable of convincing themselves they are right when the slightest amount of reason or logical thinking makes it very obvious they are not. And I dont see how such people can ever become successful poker players.
Religion is good for the mind? No, religious explanation prevents people from searching for better answers, it causes people to stop questioning things. After the bible was universally accepted as truth in the western world there was almost no scientific progress fro more than a thousand years, people had all the answers they needed so no further research required. Religion gives people all the answers they need, and that is horrible for the mind. When a child is convinced that God did it all the child no longer has a need to question or investigate things, religion smothers the childs natural curiosity and that is a terrible thing to do to a child.
Originally posted by delete461
There is one thing that all religious people have in common - they are all capable of convincing themselves they are right when the slightest amount of reason or logical thinking makes it very obvious they are not. And I dont see how such people can ever become successful poker players.
That's because you're completely oblivious to what religion tries to teach people.
what religion tries to teach people? nothing compared to what it prevents people from learning.
Sigh... Okay, let's break it down.
Originally posted by delete461
There is one thing that all religious people have in common - they are all capable of convincing themselves they are right when the slightest amount of reason or logical thinking makes it very obvious they are not.
Albert Einstein. Rings a bell?
Originally posted by delete461
Religion is good for the mind? No, religious explanation prevents people from searching for better answers, it causes people to stop questioning things.
On the contrary. Religion is supposed to make you think, consider your relationship to others and yourself, the ethics in your life, etc.
Originally posted by delete461
After the bible was universally accepted as truth in the western world there was almost no scientific progress fro more than a thousand years, people had all the answers they needed so no further research required.
The dogmatic dictatorship of the catholic church conveyed a different message than the one Jesus of Nazareth taught his students. The church was a massive organization of mostly greedy power-thirsty men. The bible was their authority, and they needed to keep their authority unchallenged. In short, if a guy like Giordano Bruno came along and claimed he had proof the world wasn't exactly like the church described, he'd get flamed medieval style. Not because religion taught people so, but because it would undermine someone's power.
Originally posted by delete461
Religion gives people all the answers they need, and that is horrible for the mind.
Religion won't tell you who invented the telephone, that's what history books are for. It will however help you get peace of mind.
Originally posted by delete461
When a child is convinced that God did it all the child no longer has a need to question or investigate things, religion smothers the childs natural curiosity and that is a terrible thing to do to a child.
Wow. So a child won't get his first basic notion of kinetics by playing with marbles just because his parents told him god created everything?
Originally posted by delete461
what religion tries to teach people? nothing compared to what it prevents people from learning.
Where is this delusion that religion's only purpose is to block out knowledge coming from? I hope you're not one of those guys who think all christians take every word of the bible literally.
I don't believe in none of that stuff, just pure fairy tales.
Like one of the posts I read here, all thinking men are atheist.
Originally posted by Berzerger
Originally posted by delete461
After the bible was universally accepted as truth in the western world there was almost no scientific progress fro more than a thousand years, people had all the answers they needed so no further research required.The dogmatic dictatorship of the catholic church conveyed a different message than the one Jesus of Nazareth taught his students. The church was a massive organization of mostly greedy power-thirsty men. The bible was their authority, and they needed to keep their authority unchallenged. In short, if a guy like Giordano Bruno came along and claimed he had proof the world wasn't exactly like the church described, he'd get flamed medieval style. Not because religion taught people so, but because it would undermine someone's power.
So why the Vatican exist nowadays? Why so much power is given to the Pope when he is basically no one?
Sigh ... ok let me go through you're points
the quote that Einstein is religious has been misquoted by christians mostly that Einstein was religious. Here is the actual qoute:
I'm not an atheist and I don't think I can call myself a pantheist. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many different languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn't know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God.
a panthiest believes that the universe and God are the same if you want to know.
Also the argument that a person in smart and believes in God thus the bible makes you think is a false one. Because you have to prove is he smart because he believes in a God or is he smart and also happens to believe a God. And looking at the graph below I tend to think it is the last of the 2 :).
Religion is to make you think? religion teaches you ethics?
If you read any of the holy books thinking is not advised. Any of the holy books are filled with inconsistencies, have views of the world in them that have proven by scientist to be false, events in those books don't match historic data.
Ethics? which ethics are that? the bible seems not to have a problem with rape and slavery, it advices killing of homosexuals, witches, killing non-believers and there are a lot of other awful things that are disapproved in modern society. Also which ethics are there in the bible that men doesn't know for themselves? Do you think that without religion people wouldn't know that killing and stealing is wrong?
religion is suppose to make you think. Well lets see what this graph has to say about that:
http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/religion_vs_iq.html
As you can see it works out quite the opposite what you claim. Since this prove the more intelligent means that people are less likely to believe in a God.
ah... Jesus message, the good stuff. Although he never wrote down anything down what he said and the chapters of the new testament weren't written after more then 100 years after they say these events happened. They still claimed they know exactly what Jesus said. But even not taking these facts into account the bible having some things in them that would have value in life doesn't prove it validity. There are a lot of books of fiction that have good messages in them but people consider them what they are books of fiction. Also the existions of Jesus is never proven, there are no historical data found of this person and the events that the bible claimed happened. Also most of Jesus so called miracles can be easily replicated by an magician.
you claim that religion doesn't intervene with science but almost all scientific founds have been highly protested against by religion and if religion had the power they once had we would never even be close the modern society we have now.
Childeren are golible. As parent you can let them believe almost anything. As an example just see how easy it is to let childeren believe there is a Santa Claus. To expose and dogtrine them into religion and teaching them they are bad and they are going to burn in hell if they don't believe in Jesus is purely psychological child abuse imo.
I don't think every Christian believe the bible literally. Most Christians just pick and choice what they like from the bible and see that as there god. Also most haven't even ever read the bible and only know what the pastors has told them.
I strongly believe if people really read the bible cover to cover and used there logical mind they would surely see how much bullshit this book is. The only way religion can survive is by using misinformation, dogma and fear.
LOL, it's pretty funny how Berzerger is the only person who belives in god in this thread 
(Or he really likes to argue with people for no reason).
I have no problem with religion, My mother is religious. And i even read a children's bible when i was younger. But if there was an all powerfull being up there.
Why would he allow such horrible things to happen on earth??
When your 8 year old child gets raped and murdered.. then that's god's will?
It would have had to be her time?
Nah, i'm just not buying it. If i was god i surely would visit earth often, even if it was only to show off my 1337 powers.
what ethics does the bible teach us?
that if somebody is homosexual we should automatically dislike them even before we meet them?
its ok to tell children they will burn in hell forever if they dont think the way I think?
The catholic church has done everything in its power to prevent contraceptives reaching africans. Now that ridiculous numbers of africans are infected with AIDS, the church isnt budging and continues to actively prevent the use of condoms.
(I know this view isnt shared by all christians, but it is the "ethics" which religious leaders have taken from their religion)
People are dying every day of cancer and leukemia, scientists are doing everything they can via stem cell research to find a cure and religious nuts are doing everything they can to impede those scientists.
Christians overwhelmingly reject the DNA evidence supporting evolution - yet they sleep soundly at night while this science is used every day in criminal courts to put people in prison. If the science really is as flawed as they would have us believe, this is a massive perversion of justice. If psychic evidence were to start being used in court there would be an uproar.
Most christians believe they are somehow morally superior to atheists yet these positions are morally abhorrent and disgusting, and religion is the ONLY reason to hold these views.
