Skip to forum
Notifications
Clear all

[Closed] NL100 SH Rush - 76o - bet, check, call line as PFR in position - eg1

5 Posts
3 Users
0 Reactions
47 Views
Tim64
Joined: 03.11.2008

Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $1(BB) Replayer
SB ($100)
BB ($47)
UTG ($152)
UTG+1 ($175)
CO ($378)
Hero ($129)

Dealt to Hero 6♦ 7♣

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $3, fold, BB calls $2

FLOP ($6.50) 7♦ 2♣ 3♣

BB checks, Hero bets $4, BB calls $4

TURN ($14.50) 7♦ 2♣ 3♣ 8♠

BB checks, Hero checks

RIVER ($14.50) 7♦ 2♣ 3♣ 8♠ 3♥

BB bets $8, Hero calls $8

villain unknown, no hands. 50 BB
flop continuation bet looks good for value and protection. In my opinion turn is classic way ahead way behind situation and we should check behind since the only worse hand we can expect to get called by is a flush draw or 45. I think if we bet, we would have to bet/fold.

The plan with this line is to get to showdown and call bet on the River depending on size. When we check behind on the turn we are signalling to the average villain that we have a weak hand and we invite him to bluff at the pot.

Some proportion of the time, when we call on the River we are behind. however, as long as we don't call a bigger bet than we would have made on the turn (in general), this line is not worse than bet/folding the turn.

when we check behind the turn, we also enable villain to make his draws some time and we have to offset this disadvantage with the fact that when we bet/fold the turn we never allow villain the opportunity to bluff at the pot.

Thoughts about this line in general and in this hand in particular?

Thanks


4 replies
VzLOM
Joined: 23.12.2007

I like it but only thing i dont agree :

In my opinion turn is classic way ahead way behind situation

it actually cant be wa wb since we were betting for value vs tons of draws while none of them completed. But yes - i agree theres not that much value already on turn.


Bierbaer
Joined: 27.05.2005

I make it $5 on the flop.

On the turn I also prefer betting.
While we sometimes valuetown ourselves against PPs or better 7x, the other times we get value from draws and a free SD.
Even better, if he has hands like 88 (or better 7x) he might even fold it sometimes because our bet looks strong.

Another disadvantage of checking is, that it will lead to a lot of riverspots where he bets and you're clueless about whether to call or to fold (which usually means you make mistakes due to a lack of information).


Tim64
Joined: 03.11.2008

Hey Phil, I doubt he is folding 88 on this turn ;)

Now, suppose we bet turn, get called and then villain fires out 2/3 pz on a blank river - e.g. Qx.

What do we do? We could call because draws missed but still end up paying off e.g. 87 for a bigger amount or we could fold because we only beat a bluff. But either way the pot is that much bigger because we bet the turn, so were more likely to make a mistake.

So, what I mean is - generally the advice is to play big pots with big hands and pot control where possible in position, so why is that not appropriate here?

thanks


Bierbaer
Joined: 27.05.2005

We discussed this in the coaching already, but I'll answer here as well.

The reason for betting the turn is to collect thin value vs possible draws and perhaps worse valuehands.
Of course sometimes we bet into a stronger hand, but against those we're calling blank rivers anyway - we lose at least the same amount (if not more if they bet big).
Additionally if draws complete on the river (i.e. the FD) he might even turn worse valuehands into a bluff and get us to fold.