[Closed] How to crush 2/4c 6-max?

Originally posted by bennisboy
You don't need to be all in to have a lead dude. It's called equity...

First learn how equity tables/calculators work, before talking about the subject. You don't even understand what I'm talking about, which in it self, proves my point.

Originally posted by bennisboy
You're overbet on the flop was idiotic, you put in 3x the pot? You could already have been drawing dead! You are isolating yourself against a better range of hands than your own, there are a very high number of bad cards that can come and leave you dead.

After you've finished figuring out how to read equity, please help yourself to the strategy section on the article of overbetting. Especially maximizing value, when you know you're ahead.

You can play by "what if I'm drawing dead on a 1/118 chance! :0" = tillydonk, I play by reads and mathematics.

Originally posted by bennisboy
But hey you're clearly a brilliant player, so don't bother to study or improve

Not on your advice, no, I don't want to "improve".

I made this thread to get advice on how to crush NL4-5, so far the best advice is this...

Originally posted by conall88
1) learn to read hands
2) learn to fold when you are behind
3) learn to value bet when you are ahead
4) stop putting people on bluffs because you think they are "playing back".

...and then some dribble from people who obviously shouldn't even be out of NL2.

Dude, you clearly don't know much about poker if you think you need to be all in to think about equity calculations.

You think you're a fantastic player, but your play suggests otherwise.

And insulting people who have given feedback on some of your hands is just ridiculous and arrogant.

What site do you play at, and what is your username?

Originally posted by bennisboy
Dude, you clearly don't know much about poker if you think you need to be all in to think about equity calculations.

Look, another one. Let's spell it out so there won't be any further misunderstandings.

Person A.) tells me it's a bad overbet, because I'm only ahead 55-65%.

55-65% takes into account the equity of BOTH streets (and you only use the equity of BOTH streets when it's AI on the flop, this is NOT AI on the flop), the overbet only applies to turn (where I'm 75% ahead on my read). I'm not shoving it all in on the flop, because I want to maximize value by getting away from any club, jack, or queen on the turn, yet still knowing I can get him to go AI even if a club doesn't hit, because the fish has already paid over 1$ into the pot, and has top pair (by my read) in addition to the flush draw.

Hence, person A.) can't even read equity. Calling an overbet with 75% equity as "dude that's bad, you're not even ahead much"... is just moronic.

Fish will chase TPFD... like ALWAYS. No matter what the pot odds are, hence they are easy to exploit with TPTK, by manipulating the pot odds greatly to your favor.

Originally posted by bennisboy
You think you're a fantastic player, but your play suggests otherwise.

Please stop giving people "advice" about exploiting them and playing their weaknesses, when you don't even understand what that means.

That's all I'm asking.

lol, you should not be overbetting that big when you're already planning to fold roughly 25% of the time. It's plain dumb.

You don't need to play spectacular poker at NL4, you just play ABC poker and let people give you their money. You complained about people being too loose, and you even invented a player type called hyper aggressive calling station, which would be exactly the kind of player you should take time and time again by playing simple poker.

You're unwilling to listen to advice from people unless they have the same opinion as you, you've told some very good poker players that they are idiots. The fact is they have more experience than a lot of people on this forum, and you should listen to what they have to say. You're not a good player, you are playing micro-stakes poker.

I accept I'm not a good player, which is why I read articles and take on board feedback to improve. The sooner you accept that you aren't special, and start listening to people that know more about the game than you, the sooner you will crush NL4.

Now's the time to insert some lame facepalm picture.

Elementary math backs me up, you have nothing, except some "I'm a humble learner, and I will blindly listen to anyone who keeps up a poker blog no matter how faulty advice they give me".

Or...

This person has 500 posts in pokerstrategy, clearly his advice is correct, even though mathematics prove otherwise.

Betting 2/3rds or the pot in a uniform board with TPTK against an opponent you think has TPFD... that's like giving away a free card, and giving him ample reason to fold when you shove the turn.

Hey c0wking,

you should listen to mathnnes indeed, and if you want to beat nl4, learn to fold and learn to extract maximum value. hand reading won't help much vs 70/50 guy, since he can basically have any two getting to turn according to your story. so, all you need is get most value when you have good hand, and learn to fold when you know you're beat (hint : big raise on the river is usually strong) .

also, on the overbet line, since you won't take anyone's advice, what do you think calls your overbet on that flop, and why would you overbet, what do you beat?

epic thread

Originally posted by FakeLunatic
hand reading won't help much vs 70/50 guy

I never said he was 70/50.

Originally posted by FakeLunatic
what do you beat?

I'm not looking to beat anything (because I already have him beat), it's just to inflate the pot size to get your opponent AI with bad odds/pot odds on the turn every time he doesn't connect.

Well, from this I figured out you meant overall :

I do understand position (I don't raise QTo from UTG eg.), but that's just bad advice for the tables I'm playing at. When my average opponent (blind) has...

VP$IP: 70 / PFR 50 / AFq 78 / Fold 2 cbet 23

you still didn't answer my question about overbet completely, you focused only on part you wanted, so let's go this way... what is a value bet? and i am curious what is his range on getting to turn in your opinion with overbet on flush flop?

Originally posted by FakeLunatic
VP$IP: 70 / PFR 50 / AFq 78 / Fold 2 cbet 23

Has nothing to do with the hand we're talking about.

Originally posted by FakeLunatic
... what is a value bet?

"Value betting is a poker strategy concept that tries to extract the most money from your opponent while you are ahead."

When I'm 75-80% ahead, I value bet. In this case, I knew he would call an over-value-bet (based on my read).

Originally posted by FakeLunatic
and i am curious what is his range on getting to turn in your opinion with overbet on flush flop?

.. my read? Top pair, flush draw. My read wasn't 100% correct, but in practise it made no difference (J in turn danger cards) + high pair + flush draw to call with.

Overbet on the flop means I win with unconnected turn shove no matter if my opponent calls or not.

If I bet normally on the flop, and then shove the rest of my stack on turn when it doesn't connect, fold equity increases too high and I lose value.

When I'm ahead so much, downplaying the hand makes no sense.

This thread seeems to be just a series of arguments which is a shame.
However, I focus on 'Decision Correct, Result Irrelevant' and can do it quite unemotionally most times, even though I make loads of mistakes and know it.
As long as we are confident we made the correct decision to the best of our ability and knowledge at the time that's ok, we can do nothing about the dealing after.

The rest is just bullshit.

If you are 100% sure he calls overbet even with TP, then ok. although, consensus is still probably that you still isolate yourself against very narrow range when you overbet flop. also, 75-80% being ahead is meh... you can calculate that by yourself with stove or equilator.

but, since you feel you have all the skill needed, and think you know your equity and value bet, you should be ok, play more than 20k hands, and then reevaluate.

altho, just from the way you type you show some obvious leaks in your game, but since you won't probably accept that as an advice, I don't want to insult you ♦

the most retarded threads get the most action.

you want to know how to beat NL4.that should say a lot about everything.

Originally posted by furculision
you want to know how to beat NL4.that should say a lot about everything.

Says the person playing NL10.

/facemelt

Originally posted by furculision
lol,big game series are rigged,like other poker tv shows probably

Tell me more.

Hi

First I want to say, c0wking, you create a thread asking "How to crush 2/4c 6-max?" you had a lot of players, some more, some less experienced, that have offered advice on the matter given the hands you provided; IMO even if you disagree with their advice, the polite thing to do would be to thank them for taking the time to answer to you rather than to get defensive and attack any criticism they offer.

There are 2 possibilities:

1) you have no leak and this is just a bad streak, a downswing or whatever you want to call it. then you don't need any advice. you just need to keep playing the way you are and you will win "IN THE LONG RUN". remember that variance has no memory. that means that you don't sum up the probability of each hands beating you in a row but you count them individually as each hand is a completely new entity of it's own; so your 0.4% is completely irrelevant.

2) you have some leaks, and most players do. If you want to work on your leaks you need to be able to take criticism and look at it objectively. Then think: yes that's right I could try to change this or that or no that I think was played optimally and I have nothing to change there. Also when you play an opponent try to forget the hand they show you. Let's say the AKo vs JJc hand for example; when you overbet, do you think your equity beats their calling range. You probably have 60-40 in your favour against JJc but you are at the very least 40-60 vs his calling range. That theory goes for over hands as well.

Best regards and I wish you better luck at the tables

Thazar

NL 10 is still 2 levels above yours.that time you dedicate to stalking,you could be dedicating it to becoming less of a douchebag and also a better player.

Originally posted by furculision
NL 10 is still 2 levels above yours.

Another /facemelt. You really are as clueless as I thought.

You "got" to NL10 by depositing money or something? I would have thought a person playing NL10 would know the limits below him...

As for talking about douchebag, the only thing I can see in your post history is pointless spam and smack talk, with zero input to anything including this thread from the first page onward.

Originally posted by c0wking

Originally posted by furculision
NL 10 is still 2 levels above yours.

Another /facemelt. You really are as clueless as I thought.

You "got" to NL10 by depositing money or something? I would have thought a person playing NL10 would know the limits below him...

As for talking about douchebag, the only thing I can see in your post history is pointless spam and smack talk, with zero input to anything including this thread from the first page onward.

youre right.i'll change my ways.no more negativity.

Try to make that 19/12, something like 19/17 and you will see the difference. Also, be open to possitive criticism. If you are good enough to beat NL4, you will find it out over a large sample. Time will tell. A Simple ABC game will do the job, i think.

Sorry for my bad English. ♦