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Making a living with STT SNGs

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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Since I am taking it rather easier today, I will make some coffee now and start responding to Tony and Prim + add my opinion to it all soon.


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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Originally posted by Primrose6789

So how do you deal with training outside of summer season? Winter is approaching now and I am wondering about path to take.

So well, swimming of course I do in an indoor swimming pool, we have something like 10°C here, but there is also the possiblity to go into an outside and heated swimming pool which is very cool but the risk of getting flu is quite high. :f_wink:

Biking is no problem. I hop on my bike and go for a ride even in the dark and cold. You just have to be a bit more careful. And running is no problem either, you need good warm clothes and after the training take a hot bath or go to the sauna. This strenghtens your immun system.

I guess the weather in Serbia must be similar to here in Germany?

Regarding SNGs and poker, welcome back to the poker world! Glad to hear you are crushing already with your ROI. Where are you grinding them now?

Thank you. I´m working hard on my game, reading theory during my breaks, while travelling and sitting in the train and on my day off and every Wednesday I attend Collins Sit and Go Coaching. :f_thumbsup:
I grind mostly on Everest Poker. That has always been my favourite poker room. About 8 years ago I played NL100 and NL200 there and it was really not difficult to win because of so many bad players who jammed their money into the pot while I was holding the nuts. :f_cool: The implied odds were HUGE!!!!

Oh well.... I shouln´t have spent all the money (shame on me)....but I´m a woman (so that´s a good excuse!) and like shopping.

So when I got back to the tables I remembered this poker room and registered again (my old account didn´t exist anymore). I already had played Sit and Go 7 or 8 years ago but just for fun. Back then it was extremely easy. The bad players just kicked each other out and you made it in the money without any efforts. :f_thumbsup: ICM? .....uh...IC.....WHAT?! :f_o:

Now that the players at the tables are a bit better one should at least know ICM.

I started with 20€ in spring of this year and have now around 85 €. I started with the 10ct-Double or Nothing and 6-max and 9-max turbo Sit and Goes, qualified by Freeroll to a 10€-MTT, cashed there, won a couple of tournament tickets by Freeroll, used them for Sit and Go or Double or Nothing and cashed and so I´m building my BR slowly, carefully, climbing up the limits.... and let´s see what happens. Winning some nice pocket money would be great. :f_thumbsup:

BTW, what is the hourly like in full time job you chose if its not a secret?

It depends on which education and how much experience you have and where you work. Guess the average worker earns something like 1.500 € per month? If you have an university degree you get more of course, as a Medical/Scientific Writer and/or Medicine/Science Journalist you can earn from 2.000€ to 3.500 € or even more if you´re good and have experience. You cannot get really rich of course but you can make a really very nice living. I personally prefer to have a bit less money but a bit more time so I decided to work only part-time.

I am wondering about this a lot for myself because for me right now it is much more +EV to stay in Serbia and play poker + teach online music vs going back to USA with much larger expenses where hourly is same like my current hourly in Serbia. Of course there is huge difference in what life in USA vs life in Serbia (as far as possibilities) offers hence the huge standard differences but regardless of it for my plan I prefer to stay here save money and get on with my plans.

Important is what you love to do! :f_thumbsup:

It makes no sense to get a well-payed job which then you don´t like at all?

It did this once. Working for the Pharmaceutical Industry (I could tell you a lot of dirty stories!!!) earning a lot of money but beeing frustrated and filling my empty soul by buying a lot of useless stuff. Shopping out of pure frustration! NEVER AGAIN!

Yes the weather is similar to Serbian for sure. I am actually planing to visit Germany in 2017. Very likely in March, month after I return to Thailand. I will visit Bon for a week or so to hang out with the friend and see whats up in Germany :)

You seem to be doing great Prim with ROI and game selection. I definitely suggest you push yourself as hard as possible and move up frequently. ICM and beauty of it is if you learn it well you can progress at stakes very fast because even at low to mid stakes people make bad calls/shoves/rcalls/3bet shoves because they don't know basics or haven't studied enough ICM.
I am positive you can get over 15$ hourly on Poker Stars playing 7s and 15s 6 max, just get very good (front load the work - knowledge) automate decisions and mass multi table - rest is bankroll management, variance and mental game.

Thanks for sharing different wages in Germany. I am glad that those are enough to survive but it reminds me a bit of USA actually. You can earn there 3-4k per month doing some full time work but the problem is what kind of life stability does that provide you or comfort. I don't want to work by the time I am 66 and then live of retirement. My goal is next 5 years to accumulate enough wealth and in the process automate and create sources of passive income not to depend anymore of me putting heavy hours in. Now my hourly with teaching is 40-50$ and with poker 30ish$. So for me to make say 5k I need to work 150 hours every month which is great but it is not ideal because that means that if I don't put time in, I loose money and spend it. Instead what I want to do is create passive streams of income where I invest and front load work (betting system that is sustainable long term and +EV, music courses and guitar community with subscription based service) and then I will make money as I sleep. Idea is to get from passive income to a point of making minimum 1k per month because with such amount I could live in Serbia, Thailand or anywhere where standard of life is not like in USA UK and such.
So with that in mind, I don't plan to take any full time job in Germany as I consider it -EV. Pay would have to be significantly higher then what I can make now (example if I can make 5k here in Serbia with music and poker, to relocate to Germany I want to be making 10k per month at least). Instead I will focus to spend less (live in Serbia or Asia), travel when I want but focus on long term money investing and growing with automation and passive income.

Finally I love music, love poker, love sports and betting (finding +EV in odds) and love helping people. I find it extremely easy to live my life with those areas active 24/7 in them. I then not consider work but rather life mission vision and huge passion.


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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Originally posted by tonypmm
It's worth adding that health should usually be given a higher priority than time / money when they're in conflict. As the easiest example, it's better to walk short distances whenever possible instead of driving. Also, it's better to go to bed on time than to play a late night freeroll that gives merely $9 to the 27th place and $150 to the unlikely 1st while surfing the internet (that's what I've just been guilty of :facepalm: as I've decided that I was too out of shape to play for serious stakes).

It is paradox of value. When you have enough money to live, you will prioritize health, when you don't have money you will prioritize money because you will need it to survive. But I agree, I would add that health should be among highest priorities in life because it affects mode and life expectancy greatly.
For late night sleep, last night I went to bed close to 3am. Watched Celtics beat Hornets and made 181$ betting 200$ on 1.91 handicap odd -2.5 :)


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Primrose6789
Joined: 01.07.2016

You seem to be doing great Prim with ROI and game selection. I definitely suggest you push yourself as hard as possible and move up frequently. ICM and beauty of it is if you learn it well you can progress at stakes very fast because even at low to mid stakes people make bad calls/shoves/rcalls/3bet shoves because they don't know basics or haven't studied enough ICM.
I am positive you can get over 15$ hourly on Poker Stars playing 7s and 15s 6 max, just get very good (front load the work - knowledge) automate decisions and mass multi table - rest is bankroll management, variance and mental game.

Oh THANK YOU! A♥:

I hope to get that far one day, it would be really nice. But first I have to beat the micros. _biggrin: Step by step: l prefer to think in many small steps, setting a couple of small goals in order to motivate myself.

First, I would like to get ICM perfectly right, to adjust to the play of my opponents quickly and correctly.

Yes, the players in the micro and low stakes make really ...uhm.....interesting calls :f_biggrin:. Especially at the bubble! I have no idea why, but first they play very tight. That´s okay. But when it comes to the bubble or near bubble, they start getting very impatient, play very loose, limp at those high blind levels and call with a lot of hands they shouldn´t.

In the micros I can observe the biggest mistakes of my opponents at the bubble, so sometimes it´s even better NOT to push but wait patiently for a strong hand.

You can earn there 3-4k per month doing some full time work but the problem is what kind of life stability does that provide you or comfort.

I heard in US employers do hire and fire? It´s easy to get fired there I think. In Germany you can´t do that. The employee is protected by the law and cannot get fired so easyly.

I don't want to work by the time I am 66 and then live of retirement.

Almost nobody wants that. Me neighter!

My goal is next 5 years to accumulate enough wealth and in the process automate and create sources of passive income not to depend anymore of me putting heavy hours in.

I understand. Many people want that, me too, well, not in the next 5 years but in the next 10-15 years. Most people are not made for a 9 to 5 job, I´m lucky having flexible working hours and a job which is really nice and okay.

Now my hourly with teaching is 40-50$ and with poker 30ish$.

That´s nice! _thumbsup:

So with that in mind, I don't plan to take any full time job in Germany as I consider it -EV.

This would make no sense! And you already have your part-time job (music).

Finally I love music, love poker, love sports and betting (finding +EV in odds) and love helping people. I find it extremely easy to live my life with those areas active 24/7 in them. I then not consider work but rather life mission vision and huge passion.

So you already have your "perfect job", actually, you indeed work and work a lot.... but you do not notice it, because it is what you love! _thumbsup:

Art ist beautyful.


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tonypmm
Joined: 11.01.2009

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77
Since I am taking it rather easier today, I will make some coffee now and start responding to Tony and Prim + add my opinion to it all soon.

Thank you for your continued writing! Of course I didn't demand any response from you - you and your godfather are going through such a difficult time now that you need to forget about your random Internet acquaintances and focus on the relationships that really matter. Don't waste time on me, please - I'm just chatting about any interesting topic that comes up here. My life is not smooth and I use poker forums as relaxing outlets, but my struggle is not nearly as tough as yours; I'd say, I'm just having First World problems.


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tonypmm
Joined: 11.01.2009

Originally posted by Primrose6789
...and now you make like 20 € per hour? That´s not so bad depending on where you live, here in Germany we unfortunately have HUGE insurance expenses and taxes! They are really ridiculously high, they eat up half of your salary/earnings! So as a poker pro or freelancer you have to earn something like 3 - 4K€ to make a decent living. You can subtract about 400€ only for your health insurance expenses!! :facepalm: Well, I'm a delusional fish, a more realistic estimate for my hourly according to the latest EV calculations is €10-15 at best. And my biggest problem is the inability to play for enough hours a week. But it's enough to earn €500 a month for a (happily) single person to pay for the rent and food in a Slav country, and it's not at all hard to earn that much in poker.

Besides, tax collection is inefficient in Russia: I think that over 99% of the local poker pros have never been told to file the 13% income tax*. I've heard that Serbian poker pros usually don't have any issues with the tax office either :f_grin:

* And even if they are, they're told to pay it in rubles according to the official USD/RUB exchange rate on the date of the USD income, which is usually way smaller than the one at the time when they have to pay the tax, so the tax is essentially less than 13% if the earnings are stored in a stable foreign currency, even if we take the fine into account.

Of course those who have no official income get no governmental support, but commercial healthcare is so cheap here that there's no need to worry about it for someone who gets their income in dollars and euros and not those constantly depreciating rubles or dinars.


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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Watching and listening now this interview after which I will respond more:


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tonypmm
Joined: 11.01.2009

(Too long; didn't watch.) Has Dan ever faced truly hard challenges in his life? I don't think he could have been in trouble regardless of his behaviour - it's hard to screw your life up if your parents give you millions of dollars.

'Zero to hero' stories are much more respectable than his.


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tonypmm
Joined: 11.01.2009

In the above, being a 'hero' means living a virtuous life, which Marcus Aurelius did despite being rich at birth, but Dan Bilzerian, Paris Hilton, the Kardashians, etc. are not doing except occasional charity donations.


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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Originally posted by tonypmm

Originally posted by Primrose6789
I started with 20€ in spring of this year and have now around 85 €. I started with the 10ct-Double or Nothing and 6-max and 9-max turbo Sit and Goes, qualified by Freeroll to a 10€-MTT, cashed there, won a couple of tournament tickets by Freeroll, used them for Sit and Go or Double or Nothing and cashed and so I´m building my BR slowly, carefully, climbing up the limits.... and let´s see what happens. Winning some nice pocket money would be great. :f_thumbsup: I wish I hadn't tried this 'small climb' 7 years ago when the games were still easy.

One has either to 'go all-in' and invest a significant % of the monthly salary and time (even several salaries over the course of a year) into being coached privately (or buying video packages) and gaining experience at serious stakes that seriously motivate to think and study; or accept that poker will always remain their hobby and they have no prospect of earning more there than at their 'real' job.


In a couple of years, only the top 1% of regs or even fewer will be still able to earn more than €3K a month by just grinding on their own (as opposed to coaching, staking or collecting Twitch donations) because poker rooms are constantly making their lives harder.

I have more than 1000 hours of experience of playing poker and I'm still struggling to earn more than €20 an hour. Admittedly, I'm much more psycho than most of the population, plus I might start earning €60 an hour this or next month if I really want to (which I doubt I do) and if I really invest the remainder of my depleted energy into it. But my struggle is giving an idea of what can happen if you don't spend as much effort on game improvement as full-time regs do... which is of course inevitable while you're doing a real job - the theory of the game, the complexity of software aids and the average skill level of regs are progressing faster than you are.

As a conclusion, don't think about playing poker seriously while you have a job... poker as an occupation is now a decent option only for those desperate people who can't find a good place in the job market for various reasons and would be starving on welfare if real money poker didn't exist, and also for residents of developing countries who would be earning far less money in their home cities if they weren't grinding or working remotely (but some poker rooms have started banning such countries for having too few or too poor recreationals, so again, poker is not going to be a reliable lifetime source of income there)
.

Lots of interesting points Tony, I will elaborate on all the text in bold.

Going all in with poker certainly has its benefits but also it can lead to huge downside with such approach. I have had several students who tried going all in but failed to make a living from poker and have very likely quit it now or simply accepted that it will be just a hobby and not a profession for them.
On the other hand there are guys who go for and have masters and doctorates like double2 from Poker Strategy and they did poker on the side and managed to improve well and beat mid stakes (nl200 zoom). So there is no specific rule per say here, I would say that it is very person dependent. It took me 3 months from playing 9 max 1.5$ to move to 5 euro 6 max SNGs to earn my 1st 1.5k euro month. In 15 months during coaching and staking program I made 30k or more, so average of 2k per month starting from not absolute beginner but actually having no ICM clue. There are people who could easily surpass what I did I am 100% positive about it - especially today. Why? Because there is much more quality videos and coaching offered, a lot more coaching and staking programs that provide significant value, but in the end it will come down to how hard person wants it? There are people who make it in 3 months while there are some that take years and are still trying to make it. I don't consider myself huge success because when it comes to knowledge in poker I am not where I want and need to be in 4 years of playing it!!! But when it comes to hourly that I make with no stress about it (no worry about rake in the game, toughness of the field, if there will be 10-20-30 new regs etc) I definitely consider myself being successful maintaining stable hourly of 25$+ post RB on site that has highest ratio of traffic and regulars (poker stars) for games that I play.
I would advise Prim or any newcomer entering poker scene now to enter coaching and staking program right away and choose wisely + be prepared to aim high and over deliver. So instead of thinking of playing certain limit, set knowledge and hourly goals. Example: I want to know range construction pre flop vs all different opponent types and how to play at least 10 flop textures range vs range vs different opponent types in 1 year while going from 3 or 5$ hourly to minimum 15$ one. Those are very specific and goals that one can monitor and track. Those kind of goals get you to focus on things that matter (learning range construction pre flop and how to adjust it, focusing on post flop while analyzing range vs range and finally focusing on monetary hourly increase) and can be easily tracked while in program. If something doesn't go right way, you can then tell your coach(es) and study partners or simply beat yourself that you are not doing enough work or are simply not motivated and have 0 talent to study and learn poker.
By the way I will list here for 2017 my goals this way as well when the time comes and will during updates let you all know how I am progressing with them!
Finally regarding this 1st point, I think most people will never accept that poker can be just their hobby because by admitting that they admit that they lost (they wanted to become pro but failed and now whats the point playing it?!?). So I see a lot of potential wanna be professionals burn out, give up and quit poker all together.

2nd point, definitely don't agree with it. I used to have this sort of thinking and fear 3 years ago after 1st year of playing poker and making 2k or more per month. Used to ask and tell myself same stuff: "what if in couple of years players improve, sites make changes etc?" "what if games become unbeatable, what if my hourly drops?". These are questions that scream fear fear fear and tell more about us as poker players and human beings feeling unsecured. Nobody can guarantee you anything in life, if they do make sure you check their proof and sources as over 90% of people will just make bold claims and not be able to back them up. What I realized is that nothing really changed for worse for me in those 3 years and actually I feel even more excited about poker now then 3 years ago when it comes to future of it. Here are some reasons why I see future of poker bright and not dark in any way:
- While sites like PokerStars are increasing rake and lowering RB for players, games are still very beatable and there are formats which provide huge edge for hourly for those willing to play them (spins of course!)
- People on 15s today and 3 years ago haven't improved much, actually very little. There are maybe several regs that know some post flop but most of them are ICM or cEV pre flop wanna be charts and gto machines that are flawed in so many ways. So there is still tons of value to play this limit, there is still way to make a lot of money and to increase the win rate as well because 15s and 25$+ hourly is just scratching the surface for someone wanting to JUST DO POKER.
- People in general are comfort seeking and lazy when they reach some goal that they aimed for long time. This results into tons of regs staying at same limit, not improving, not even trying to move up just carrying about money aspect of poker for them. I can certainly blame myself for still having 30ish $ post RB. I could have entered Smart Spins or similar program, busted my balls with studying and play now much higher stakes with improved knowledge but I choose to play on my own and save money for mortgage to help my family. 2 years ago I also made similar decision in 2014 where for whole year I was using poker winnings to help my family. 2015 I invested in my poker education and switch to CG, took tons of coaching, watched and learned from tons of videos, coached CG, beat certain stakes, and now I am back at spins "printing money". I definitely see myself moving my hourly and moving up the stakes but that is also conditioned by life things. I can't say for certain that by end of 2017 I will play 60s and 100s. It would be cool and awesome for sure, especially knowledge wise to feel absolute control and enjoy every single hand of every single session, however bankroll is very important and where the winnings go from poker. I can't predict if my dad will need me to jump in with my poker money or if investing in automation and betting system will provide BE - or + results in 2017! All these things require money and poker moving up requires BR as well (for serious move up, not taking shots).
- Today unlike 3-4 years ago, there tons more quality coaching materials and systems. Software that can teach GTO, close to optimal play styles and that teaches you how to adjust to someones play style.
- If there is all this information available now, why isn't poker dead already??? Because people regardless if you give them information or not, they need to go through the process themselves and put it a lot of hours to get to point of decent to good to great to awesome to god like mode to Doug Polk and Ben Sulsky like. And there lies the answers why this claim that only 1% of regs will make money is not true. 3k or more or less is nothing fancy in poker really. If you said however 30k+ per month, that would have been a bit different because at those amounts and stakes, people making this money really do use all the information and software available to them and study like crazy to be ahead of the curve and those people will still make 30k+ per month, but the ones that don't study GTO, don't do enough DB analysis, don't know range vs range enough, don't figure out individual exploits on their stakes of play, don't do solid site and table selection - those people will likely in several years drop from 30k+ per month to 10k or so per month (basically drop down a limit or 2 and decrease hourly). For 3k however that is not going to happen and honestly the only way that it could happen if bots started playing on 15s GTO poker with sick adjustments to opponent stats and tendencies - I can see my hourly going down then and decreasing. Until then I really don't see people getting any better , because those who do get a lot better and are very ambitios and hard working, they move up in stakes, those who are content with their win rate (myself included) stay on the stake to print, those who came to that stake to improve come with weaker win rate and loose to regs such as myself, and then there is always tons of recreationals who willingly come to play for fun and loose vs us in the process. It is the way things work and will work in years to come especially on this low limit. 100s spins different stories and 60s. 15s even 30s - still tons of recreational players and weak players (including myself) which any given hard working dedicated individual with solid crafted plan and master execution with right support system (coach) can crush like a boss.
- I suggest watching Doug Polk's YouTube video on future in Poker where he mentions redbaron as positive example of rising star and hero story from mid to high stakes in today's rough times.

Your 3rd point, definitely can relate to it as a lot of people can. Thing to understand is that even though you have more then 1000 hours experience, that doesn't entitle you me or anyone to have expectation of higher hourly. It is like me saying I played more then 1000 hours football but am I making money from it or playing like Messi? Of course not!
So the real truth lies in how you spent those 1000 hours. Why did Fedor Holtz own everyone's ass? Is he talented and smartest player in the world? Highly doubt it! Watch his interview/conversation with Joey Ingram. He said it in a very smart and somewhat hidden way that he sat down and figured out SYSTEM how to tackle all common scenarios (80-20 rule anyone? ;) and started consistently working on all of those areas. That eventually lead to him understanding all the common spots at both basic and very advanced level and he did that while moving up and crushed everyone's soul.
That is the way to do things. Investing time smart vs just doing things.
I am not doing things smart vs Fedor. I am investing time and grinding like person working in a coffee shop or drugstore would. I know my hourly, I play, I make money, get my paycheck and cash out. I put a lot of time but I don't improve like I should.
Solution is to do both. Find balance of playing and making money (because you play poker to make money like 99% people would want to right?) but also consistently study and work on improving your game. That is the cure for not having 20 euro or 25-30-35$ hourly (your and my case) and same works for person that has higher hourly then you and me have. I even think 100$ hourly person who makes on average say 10-15k per month thinks in the same terms. "What do I need to continue to work on to improve myself as poker player and increase my hourly?". Those are the questions we need to ask, figure out systematic way how to tackle them and apply 80-20 rule to make it minimalism and simple to follow.

Your final point, in some points I agree with you in some don't. Again we come back to hourly. We all have to start somewhere. It is hour mind and limiting beliefs + lack of action taking and systematic way to improve that stand in our way to become better poker players and improve.
Just because you make 20 and I make 30-35$ per hour doesn't mean we will stay there - it depends on us. And it doesn't matter if you are in Russia and I am in Serbia or you are in USA and I am in UK. Expenses sure vary in different countries but if you are truly serious about becoming poker professional you will push yourself to learn everything there is and to become best in the world.
My goal used to be to become best at poker but then it faded not because I got discouraged or anything like that, on contrary I realized that my life without music and helping people doesn't carry same weight just like living without training doesn't do it for me. So I just prioritize different things now. That does not however mean that I will not tackle my hourly increase and knowledge improvement in 2017. The reason is simple why 2017 - because by then I will have 0 debt and all the money that I earn will go to me and my personal needs. That means I can take more time to study and improve, less to grind , create healthier balance between the 2 and continue to improve and move up the ladder. I wish this to everyone to do TODAY who is debt free, has financial stability (decent BR for poker and life) and not way for magic month day or year because that day will never come!

Hope this response benefit the community, probably took me over 1 hour to write it all in 1 go :)


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stevegold87
Joined: 18.06.2009

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77

Originally posted by stevegold87
hey i'm getting back into the SNG action and your blog is very interesting to me, I like how you talk about different aspects of your life. I will follow. Take care

Appreciate it Steve. Wish you all the best on your road with SNGs. Where are you playing them now?

Playing on 888.
Btw thanks for writing, reading your blog motivates me to be a better person and also think about my health. :f_drink:


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Primrose6789
Joined: 01.07.2016

I would advise Prim or any newcomer entering poker scene now to enter coaching and staking program right away and choose wisely + be prepared to aim high and over deliver.

Thank you very much, I appreciate every good advice! All of your posts are really encouraging!

As I mentioned I go slowly, carefully, entering the poker world step by step and keeping up my job in any case not only because of the terribly high insurance costs, it´s also very nice to have something besides poker, especially when you are in a big downswing.

Then I want to be free to say: Well, I have a break from poker, I don´t have to make a living from poker, I concentrate now more on art. I want to keep this kind of freedom, that´s why I say: Hobby player with ambitions. :f_thumbsup:

By the way I watched your coaching-video with Collin: You analyse your opponents really precisely and very well! Wow, I was impressed. It seems to me like Science. The way of thinking, I remember that from University, also ICM, we indeed learned the probability calculations, of course not for cards but for atoms and molecules. :f_biggrin:

Altough I haven´t worked as a research scientist for 10 years, I won´t forget the way of calculating and puzzling things together and draw conclusions from the informations I have. And I like that!

Maybe I play poker because I miss Science a bit? :f_biggrin:

also think about my health. :f_drink:

*taking the beer away from Steve and serving him a nice cup of tea* :f_biggrin: :f_thumbsup:


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stevegold87
Joined: 18.06.2009

also think about my health. :f_drink:
*taking the beer away from Steve and serving him a nice cup of tea* :f_biggrin: :f_thumbsup:

haha good one :]


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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Couple of quick things to update on:

1) Studying
Spent over 2 hours and today over 1 hour going over very specific spot that I feel I need to improve in. Discovered some quite interesting approach from GTO perspective and then also practiced vs expected ways people play and actually landed on strategy I was already using which is pretty brutal! Turns out that vs expected playing style of average opponent I was doing everything that software suggests on flop. Mind you, this is just flop analysis but still I am happy to be very good at adjusting vs field play and especially happy to learn GTO for such spot because it will help me A LOT adapt vs better opponents who play in such spot better. 3 hours it took me to do that 1 flop spot alone, now you see why it can take 100s of hours to study like this and why very few % will have courage to take this road in studying.
Also analyzed with Elpsycho another specific spot which I wanted to check what I taught was happening vs actual db analysis. Turns out my expectations were correct but this morning after last nights study I started to play those spots more towards GTO which is WRONG because I was missing out on tons of value vs fiel on 15s. So lesson to be learned and applied is following: Learn GTO to know how to play vs very good opponents who are balanced and understand range vs range very well but focus more on learning what average opponents do at your stake and exploit their leaks for maximizing EV. I am confident this approach works for 30s (doing db analysis for the field and then adjusting all the strategy based on it) while on 60s+ I expect that people are more balance therefore GTO approach vs them doesn't burn money or loose EV significantly.
Finally, made a decision with Elpsycho to spend at least 15 minutes per day to study very specific spot(s) using 80-20 rule. Already feel much more confident about this particular spot we tackled together and only 3 hours or more were put into it. I can imagine what will come out of it when I do 10-20 flop textures with different run outs practicing both GTO and exploited style of play to maximize EV. This will probably mean massive increase in ROI and cEV in future, like by 10-20-30 cEV at least which will decrease variance and increase hourly and most importantly improve me as a player which is bottom line for me.

2) Training and weight loss
Yesterday had brutal training which I completed like a boss. Because of it today I have my legs canceling on me whole day. Moved today's training for tomorrow which will be cardio like training. Weight loss in the mean while staying in 1 place or going in circles. I spent now whole month going over my calorie deficit each week and my weight has changed from 80.6 to 82.5kgs on and off. Reason is simple, I enjoy candy and sweats too much and I buy them and eat them all!!! So in the next weeks I will focus to either 80-20 rule, eating candy 1 day per week instead of every day, or I will take them out all together to speed up my weight and body fat dropping. Since I have more then enough time before Thailand to drop 4-5kgs, regardless of 12.5 weeks remaining, I want to complete my goal before end of this year so 8-9 weeks to drop 4-5kgs while also dropping body fat % down. Should and will be EZ game just have to tone down sweats and candy cravings

3) Grind November
Going for 150 hours with idea to complete whole stake with my friend in November. If I hit profit mark before that, I will likely stop playing 5 hours per day and focus on adding more studying (GTO vs Exploitable and using 80-20 rule) and then see what happens.

4) Results in October
I haven't put numbers together but I believe from poker, betting and music lessons I made close to if not 5k. Very successful month considering that I played close to or a bit less then 100 hours of poker. Very nice!

5) Getting new wardrobe and clothes for winter
Since I lost 15kgs or so, my body composition changed of course and now I need new wardrobe. I will wait until I get to 77kgs and then go buy new clothes. Talk to a female friend of mine who is in Boston and she is into fashion and loves to talk about what goes with what so she will be my personal assistant when it comes to fashion advice which is pretty cool. I will go take pictures of all the stuff that is available and that I dig and she can help me out with her suggestions. EZ game,everybody wins, synergy for the win!

6) Mortgage payment
Very soon, I will go with my dad to bank and finish everything regarding apartment mortgage. Very likely I will take that day off from poker and celebrate it with family 1st and then friends as it is very big accomplishment and reason I came back from USA to Serbia on 13th of March 2016.

Enjoy your November and I will see you in some future update :)


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tonypmm
Joined: 11.01.2009

Serbian families are knit so tightly. Congrats on the accomplishment :f_thumbsup: but try not to drink too much rakija :f_wink:

The celebration of my final payment for the future apartment consisted in eating above maintenance on the N-th day in a row - a full 225 g pack of Kosmostars (fortified cereals) with 0.5% fat milk and a lot of slices of whole-grain bread. By mutual agreement, I didn't even bother to meet any of my relatives. My family consists of one coolest person on the planet :f_cool:

Originally posted by Primrose6789
*taking the beer away from Steve and serving him a nice cup of tea* :f_biggrin: :f_thumbsup: *expropriating the cup of tea and returning Steve's smoothie to him*


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Primrose6789
Joined: 01.07.2016

I enjoy candy and sweats too much and I buy them and eat them all!!!

You are not the only one! :sifflote:

Learn GTO to know how to play vs very good opponents who are balanced and understand range vs range very well but focus more on learning what average opponents do at your stake and exploit their leaks for maximizing EV.

Can you tell us more about that?


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tonypmm
Joined: 11.01.2009

Originally posted by Primrose6789

I enjoy candy and sweats too much and I buy them and eat them all!!!

You are not the only one! :sifflote: Forcing myself to stop buying sweets at all has probably been my best decision of this year. Alas I've relapsed into adding sugar into caffeinated drinks but I've also started eating tons of apples as a replacement. Low glycemic index foods are the way to go.


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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Originally posted by stevegold87

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77

Originally posted by stevegold87
hey i'm getting back into the SNG action and your blog is very interesting to me, I like how you talk about different aspects of your life. I will follow. Take care

Appreciate it Steve. Wish you all the best on your road with SNGs. Where are you playing them now?

Playing on 888.
Btw thanks for writing, reading your blog motivates me to be a better person and also think about my health. :f_drink:

Very cool. I caught your blog the other day, definitely following. Hope your traffic on 888 is strong and that you make all the money and achieve all the goals you set!
It is my pleasure to inspire you since it is part of my life's work to influence and change lives of people for better (leave this planet in better place then I found it in).


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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Originally posted by Primrose6789

I would advise Prim or any newcomer entering poker scene now to enter coaching and staking program right away and choose wisely + be prepared to aim high and over deliver.

Thank you very much, I appreciate every good advice! All of your posts are really encouraging!

As I mentioned I go slowly, carefully, entering the poker world step by step and keeping up my job in any case not only because of the terribly high insurance costs, it´s also very nice to have something besides poker, especially when you are in a big downswing.

Then I want to be free to say: Well, I have a break from poker, I don´t have to make a living from poker, I concentrate now more on art. I want to keep this kind of freedom, that´s why I say: Hobby player with ambitions. :f_thumbsup:

By the way I watched your coaching-video with Collin: You analyse your opponents really precisely and very well! Wow, I was impressed. It seems to me like Science. The way of thinking, I remember that from University, also ICM, we indeed learned the probability calculations, of course not for cards but for atoms and molecules. :f_biggrin:

Altough I haven´t worked as a research scientist for 10 years, I won´t forget the way of calculating and puzzling things together and draw conclusions from the informations I have. And I like that!

Maybe I play poker because I miss Science a bit? :f_biggrin:

also think about my health. :f_drink:

*taking the beer away from Steve and serving him a nice cup of tea* :f_biggrin: :f_thumbsup:

That is awesome that you decided to do both and keep poker as ongoing option in your life. Keep in mind, downswing has no specific length. That is the beauty of poker after all because you can play perfect and loose money for long periods of time. This is what just like winning a lot in short time clouds judgment in development or evaluating your own ability in poker. Aim to improve, to play your best and understand why you and your opponents do certain things. Become great at adapting and reading people and you will be fine over long period/stretch.

Thank you for watching videos with Collin. I really enjoyed doing all those webinars with him! It was fun to grind stakes that I play and for us to discuss life things while covering spots at the same time. I remember I was doing CG once as well in our webinar playing nl25zoom where 1 very interesting hand came and I was ready to fold over pair after bet facing shove on river. Very interesting spot and spent probably 15+ minutes analyzing it trying to teach people who watched it live to understand relative vs absolute strength hand concept - something that people in 2016 still struggle with.
I did my best always in those coachings and mentioned my thinking process. I am definitely now even more evolved with understanding of range vs range, textures, actions taken by different player types, how to adjust sizing based on different hands to extract max +EV play, what potential GTO is for certain spots. Of course, I am still very far from where I want to be and that is to take 1st all the difficult textures and solve them from flop to river with different sizings for GTO then practice vs exploitable/expected plays and then move on to "easier" textures which I feel I have no struggle with at all. This will make me more complete and absolutely fearless opponent at players when I play HU in Spins that I can adjust instantly based on opponents tendency and maximize my EV vs such opponent. IT will and it takes time, but this is the way, this is the present and future of poker. Gone are the days when 1 solution to fit it all strategy wise was working. Now you need to make a lot of money be able to go above and beyond what other opponents are willing to do. Since most of them do nothing or very little to improve, you can see how this plan executed well will get me where I want to be - better overall player, improved hourly and higher limits (with growth of BR).

Poker is science no doubt. People think it is easy doing what we do, they think it is gambling. It couldn't be further from the truth. So many variables have to be taken into account in bringing single decision that seems +EV at that moment. Most things don't work that way but if you understand and approach poker that way you are likely going down the road of Polk and Sulsky and other dream machines :)


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IvicaIliev77
Joined: 31.05.2012

Originally posted by tonypmm
Serbian families are knit so tightly. Congrats on the accomplishment :f_thumbsup: but try not to drink too much rakija :f_wink:

The celebration of my final payment for the future apartment consisted in eating above maintenance on the N-th day in a row - a full 225 g pack of Kosmostars (fortified cereals) with 0.5% fat milk and a lot of slices of whole-grain bread. By mutual agreement, I didn't even bother to meet any of my relatives. My family consists of one coolest person on the planet :f_cool:

Originally posted by Primrose6789
*taking the beer away from Steve and serving him a nice cup of tea* :f_biggrin: :f_thumbsup: *expropriating the cup of tea and returning Steve's smoothie to him*

Thanks Tony

I think it has nothing to do with Serbian families. It comes down to who we are, how we approach life, what do we consider of value and importance. I know people in USA who are not living capitalist lifestyle chasing career dreams and highs but who rather give up millions to spend time with family. I also know people in Serbia that don't care about family at all and just look at themselves. It is all personal choice. We choose how we want to live our lives, nobody can force you to do anything. We have free will and ability to make decisions and follow up on them.
I choose to help my family because they did everything in their life to make my life full filling and happy. Even when there were impossible times (wars) I was isolated in the room playing guitar 12+ hours because I believed in myself and ability that I can make a difference in the world. Tables are turned now, I have ability to help them so I choose to do so because if somebody deserves my help and support it is them.

Celebration not happening yet but will let you know when everything is done! Rakija is a must of course for such occasion no way around it


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