600nl I cb and he goes barmy

yea with no overbet history/reads i call this as well. you are probably at the literal top hand in your range, you have the nf blocker, he should be good enough to know you have ~0 flushes. snapple it up and take a note either way.

If somehow you have AdQx here then I think its a good spot to make a bluff. Definitely think he can have value hands he intends to b/f. I actually think it's close between call and bluff raise with this hand; the thing which swayed it to call for me is that he hasn't just overbet, he's made it almost 2x pot which imo polarizes him more than 1.2x pot.

I don't think we should turn anything into a bluff when we consider how polarised his range is.

I would call with all my bluff catchers the first time round. This is mainly so I can develop reads on his turn/river overbets, if this guy is going to be a long term reg that I am going to battle with and then I can adjust accordingly.

His turn bet is really confusing. No idea what he wants to accomplish with that - most likely we're calling only with Tx, but c/r would make more sense if he goes for value. I really hate calling that river without any reads, but I guess that's the only way to get some I don't think it's good idea to turn this hand into a bluff if he's known to be aggro. He might even jam over our raise because we can't have the nuts and we can have only 1 combo with Ahi flush ... Also we should take his flop donkbet range into a consideration if he donks, ofc. Many people who do, would donk almost all strong hands and fds on this flop. I don't like value raising on this turn, I rather slowplay my Tx and raise the river, obv not vs overbet or flush cards.

v nice betsize for value from villain. I actually doubt that he's bluffing here since it rly looks like hero has a Tx here a lot. But then again, i'm not folding this hand...

With no bet-sizing reads you are happy to give this guy credit for overbetting turn and river as a bluff? Not saying it's incorrect - but with no bet-sizing reads I'd assume he has value frequently enough that you can't really bluffcatch.

Originally posted by pleno1
Kinda struggled with what = what here, does ace high always = a10 here in relative hand strength?

I don't think so. AT beats all of his bluffs while Ace-high doesn't. If he's aggressive he could be merging with a worse T.

The advantage to calling is you get a read - plus if you think he could be merging you aren't purely bluff-catching. In reality I'm probably folding unless I'm gonna be playing a long session and really value the info-EV.

Obviously I don't know the guy but it's hard to see him overbetting the turn with a FD anyway. Most likely scenario imo is he probably has a boat and sees value-town on a diamond river.

I think that a good percent of your perceived checking back range is going to be Tx so even though overbetting would permit villain to bluff a lot of the time unexploitably I think that he is not going to do it here (very nice betsizing with the nuts!).

i dont like not cbeting vs competent agro plr as u have a lot of options for further barelling, and also standing vs a c/r on F

as played, snap and lose most of the time unless he is a total maniac, fold and throw ur game off for the rest of the session by making a weak fold.

Originally posted by TheLastNail

as played, snap and lose most of the time

It think it's pretty criminal to not cbet this for value given how wide both of us are going to be here, and the fact that we have a hand we can easily call a c/r.

As played, I think we need to call river here blocking the NF. We're likely quite a bit stronger than he thinks we are, and block the majority of value combos.

This is obv a snap call, top of range, blocker etc etc.

I would not turn Qx into a bluff, I don't expect him to fold anything that he vbets river with as he is just going to reason that we would cbet flop with FDs and 2pair/sets close to 100% of the time. I'm probably just snapping almost everything here tbh, he knows our range is super weak and still overbets, smells like a bluff to me! Unless of course villain is good and knows you are good as well obv.

you only beat a few combos of k 10

And bluffs

pretty snap-worthy spot imo, although it sucks

Originally posted by pleno1

Originally posted by TheLastNail

as played, snap and lose most of the time

some say poker imitates life in the decision making process..

i think this is 1 great example of how both, ur kid and ur wife slipped off the cliff and are now barely hanging on to each of ur arms. No matter which 1 u let slip to save the other, 1 could mathematically classify is as -EV. However isnt it more abt choosing a decision which u re more likely to go on to accept?!

i doubt a good plr will rly bluff into ur Tx heavy range on T&R. However if u just fold u ll never be completely sure and that might cost u more vs him in the future.. and in the end, as w the cliffstory, u must make a decision before u run out of time and let just the fate (timebank) decide That i think is the worst u can do thinking longertermwise.

yea, and i like turning some Tx into bluff, but not in this exact runout and only vs a (very) good plr.

fe if u have 8T on board and R comes A/K and not bringing the flush.

as said i cant see him having many bluffs here as the way you play this you have a ten often here plus you havnt much info on him then nor him on you,

with the lack of history this is more valuetown than degen bluff imo

Interesting hand. I think the problem with calling is that if he has only basic handreading skills its pretty obvious that we have some sort of Tx here. Its really hard for us to have anything else since we cb flop and then called the big turn overbet.

So for us to call we need to expect him to try to bluff us off Tx. And given he is 2xing pot from his point of view the bluff has to work like 65% of the time? Not sure on the math but is he really expecting us to fold Tx so often?

On the other hand he can easily valuebet any flush/boat this way since our range is capped to AT.

I personally don't play that high where player pool is much smaller and calling for info and future EV is worth way more then on low stakes but in a vacuum i think folding is max EV.

Quick question,

what do you think our turn calling range should look like?

If it is super thin, then it creates the new topic of overbetting the turn vs missed cbet, I've been doing this alot and the regs all seem to just give up.

Anybody else had such experiences?

Originally posted by pleno1
Quick question,

what do you think our turn calling range should look like?

If it is super thin, then it creates the new topic of overbetting the turn vs missed cbet, I've been doing this alot and the regs all seem to just give up.

Anybody else had such experiences?

In vacuum we probably should call only with Tx vs that sizing.

I don't like the idea of overbetting turn vs missed cbet. It's super easy to exploit that - just check back the nuts on flop ♠_cool: I haven't tried this, but I tried some similar line some time ago - I open and flop comes like T97ss. I cbet, villain calls. Then I overbet blank turn. It worked for some time, but later they just started to slowplay any set vs me and that doesn't work anymore

I think much better line would be to bet normal sizing on the turn and then overbet the river, which is pretty common.