AT vs 2 - top2 on "wet" board

Originally posted by yangmartins
This seemed pretty much standard, for me, until SD. When I saw their hands it made me re-evaluate a lot this hand.

If you'd do anything different, when and how? ty

 I would raise 3x pre-flop. Yeah I know that it is old-school, but when you get folds, you get the blinds rake-free.
 I would raise the turn to half-pot or more. I'll let others talk about sizing
 I would never fold top two.

Did you run this hand through Equilab?
I'm guessing you had some decent equity

Cheers,
VS

Regarding PF raise, I don't think 2.4BB to 3BB will make them fold. In the long run it hurts me a little more than them, as I open wide from CO/BTN and I like to keep it the same size with bottom and top of my range. So I think the 1/2BB I save when I get raised over my trash hands "pays" for when I am called with my decent ones. But I am open for debate on this subject. I've been a little lasy to do extensive math on this. On NL 2 I was a little more straight forward and am still asjusting open size on NL5.

Regarding the turn, I actually thought about about that, about 1/2 pot size...would I get called by non Flush hands, specially against 2? On the long run wouldn't that be trashing money?

If they dind't go to SD, that'd be an easy fold I would never think about again, but when I saw their hands...

I just ran the hand equity. If I give them QJ, JT, QT, KT and flush, I don't get 5% for me (note below), so what range would you place them?

Note when running equity on this hand, noticed something I also equated when I folded: Most of the hands that I'd beat on that scenario would need a T. I have one, there is other in the board. So it is not likely that one (and even less both) villain has a T in his hand, thus increasing the likelywood of str8 and Flush. I think this is what weighted more in my fold

Regarding PF raise, I don't think 2.4BB to 3BB will make them fold.

I grind 2 sites, one small local only player pool and GGP. I have 2 different strategies for both. The local one I play more passive (have a limping range etc), as I have 4 to 5 players to every flop, it doesn't matter what I raise, I've experimented lots. I play with the exact same players all the time and have detailed notes on everyone.
A donk on a flop like above normally means strength eg TP (sometimes sets)and at the same time fear eg FD or SD (yes fear as they discuss the hands in the chat). The turn bet is one of 2 things, I am no longer as strong as I was on the flop or I now have the nutz and I want YOU to raise me, you should look at those min bets as checks and never raise. The river half pot is value, almost always, but not always the nutz. I both call on the river and fold, its really depends.
Trying to put them on a range is almost impossible, I note their tendencies, bet sizes are the biggest tell, they never deviate from their pattern.

I have 2 years worth of footage of me just getting wrecked by players like this. I know everyone wants to play with this kinda players, but I will gladly take a table of regs that I can put on a range and bluff over a table that never folds...

Originally posted by VorpalF2F

Originally posted by yangmartins
This seemed pretty much standard, for me, until SD. When I saw their hands it made me re-evaluate a lot this hand.

If you'd do anything different, when and how? ty

 I would raise 3x pre-flop. Yeah I know that it is old-school, but when you get folds, you get the blinds rake-free.
 I would raise the turn to half-pot or more. I'll let others talk about sizing
 I would never fold top two.

Did you run this hand through Equilab?
I'm guessing you had some decent equity

Cheers,
VS

Raising turn vs 2 isn't it going to get calls from made flushes only?

I would most likely raise the flop to try to get in against the short stack with top pair top kicker.

Turn bet of the BB is basically a check. I would raise at least half pot to isolate the short stack and protect my hand. Flush seems unlikely in the SB range and BB min bet looks weak.

Cheers,
SDK1987