Quiz of the week: Playing the Calling Station in Position

interesting quiz

Hi,

it's a good quiz (happy with my 74%) but I couldn't find an answer option for Q7. If there had been, I'm sure it would have been 80%+ ♦

Tim

You scored 29 out of 34 possible points. This corresponds to 85 % !
I'm satisfied More to come!

Hmm barely got to tier 1 (26pts)
I guess I should consider limping from the button more often :lol:

But ohh well, what can come from a player that never used stats in his life

I've been beat so many times in the quiz #10 question. If not by the flush itself, to a 4 flush. I automatically fold this hand in that situation 99.9% of the time. Saves me lots of money in the long run, and I don't get called a donk or fish.

You scored 26 out of 34 possbile points. This corresponds to 76 % !

Sorry but I don't get it. Calling station open raises from utg, when he has pfr of 0, over reasonable ammount of hands.

If I would play against calling station who only called or folded 300 hands ( reasonable ammount), and he's raising now, I would muck AKo right away.

I don't get it how the right answer is call or even 3bet (1 point)?

Agreed, vs someone with less than 1% EP open raise I will fold AK and setmine with QQ. He ALWAYS has KK+ here. You could call for a QJT or AAK flop but I'd prefer playing roulette. 3betting would just be lighting money on fire.

Coincidentally, this is exactly what I was about to ask (concerning question 3 in this case).

I have calculated how profitable both answers that award points are in this case:

Call
We need to call $0,40 for a $1,35 pot and so we need ~29,6% equity to make this call profitable. Against KK+ we have ~19,5%. Also, we'd be playing this pot multiway postflop which isn't advisable either in my opinion.
So: bad option.

Squeeze/broke
If we squeeze, we would squeeze to $1,60. UTG+1, having a PFR of 0 and opening from UTG, can't have anything else but KK+ here. This also means we have zero FE if we squeeze (he *might* lay down KK if he's extremely nitty, but considering the fact that he has 20/0 stats, I don't think he's a very good player and so he would never lay down KK). In fact, I don't see him do anything but 4bet here, because he will not want to call and play his big pair OOP postflop.
So, he will probably 4bet. As his UTG opening range is extremely tight, he'll 4bet with that same range he openraised with: KK+.
Let's say he'll 4bet to 2,5 times our squeeze, so he'll make it $4.
Now we have to call $2,40 for a $8,95 pot. This means we need ~26,8% equity. Again, against KK+ we have ~19,5% and again, we can't make a profitable call.
However, calling wasn't an option here as we're playing squeeze/broke. So he 4bets, we push, he calls and we get all the money in and win the pot about 20% of the time.

This means that 4 out of 5 times we lose $10, so that's $40.
And 1 out of 5 times we win $10,55.

Long story short: for every 5 times we do this, we lose a net amount of $29,45, meaning each time we do this, we (on average) lose $5,89.

I say let's fold preflop ♦...

I've also got some doubts about Q12, with the KTo and the recommendation to raise to .80 in order to "chase the weak hands away".

Imo it is in Calling Stations' nature to not get chased away. They'll very often call with their 89, 56, 78 and suited shizzle type of hands. Also, they're quite likely to limp/call hands that got us dominated, i.e. KQ, AK, KJ, AT - they're passive calling stations in the end.

So what we'll end up doing is creating a bloated pot with players than don't like to fold their weak draws, 2nd pairs, TPs-weak kicker; and even if we hit and try to value town them we might very well be valuetowning our own ass instead.

therefore for me it's a fold!

PS. i got 29/34

30/34

and I absolutely disagree with Q3 about squeeze/broke option vs 20/0 guy my though was squeeze/fold is an ok play especially if 20/0 folds and 40/10 calls OOP.

Originally posted by Orodin
Coincidentally, this is exactly what I was about to ask (concerning question 3 in this case).

I have calculated how profitable both answers that award points are in this case:

Call
We need to call $0,40 for a $1,35 pot and so we need ~29,6% equity to make this call profitable. Against KK+ we have ~19,5%. Also, we'd be playing this pot multiway postflop which isn't advisable either in my opinion.
So: bad option.

Squeeze/broke
If we squeeze, we would squeeze to $1,60. UTG+1, having a PFR of 0 and opening from UTG, can't have anything else but KK+ here. This also means we have zero FE if we squeeze (he *might* lay down KK if he's extremely nitty, but considering the fact that he has 20/0 stats, I don't think he's a very good player and so he would never lay down KK). In fact, I don't see him do anything but 4bet here, because he will not want to call and play his big pair OOP postflop.
So, he will probably 4bet. As his UTG opening range is extremely tight, he'll 4bet with that same range he openraised with: KK+.
Let's say he'll 4bet to 2,5 times our squeeze, so he'll make it $4.
Now we have to call $2,40 for a $8,95 pot. This means we need ~26,8% equity. Again, against KK+ we have ~19,5% and again, we can't make a profitable call.
However, calling wasn't an option here as we're playing squeeze/broke. So he 4bets, we push, he calls and we get all the money in and win the pot about 20% of the time.

This means that 4 out of 5 times we lose $10, so that's $40.
And 1 out of 5 times we win $10,55.

Long story short: for every 5 times we do this, we lose a net amount of $29,45, meaning each time we do this, we (on average) lose $5,89.

I say let's fold preflop ♦...

dude. if we know exactly what hands he has (AA-KK) and know he will never fold them postflop, we should call with atc that can make a draw or set, knowing we can fold cheaply if we miss the flop or stack him when we hit our flush/set/straight/2pair

NEVER fold pf vs such a tight opening range, and never 3bet either

Yes we should call with almost anything, but not AK. AK is the worst hand ever against KK+, what are you looking to flop? I'd rather call with a low suited two gapper than AK here.

742, best flop ever, you can fold with a clear conscience

A32, you have tptk. You will lose money against his AA and get little value from his KK.

K32, snapfold.

AK2, you have top two and still have to fold.

AKK, you will be forced to fold a full house.

QJT/AAK, only flop you want to continue on. How often do you think you will hit this?

nice quiz

Originally posted by Maniatrix
Yes we should call with almost anything, but not AK. AK is the worst hand ever against KK+, what are you looking to flop? I'd rather call with a low suited two gapper than AK here.

742, best flop ever, you can fold with a clear conscience

A32, you have tptk. You will lose money against his AA and get little value from his KK.

K32, snapfold.

AK2, you have top two and still have to fold.

AKK, you will be forced to fold a full house.

QJT/AAK, only flop you want to continue on. How often do you think you will hit this?

was more disagreeing with his point which is to fold because we have such low equity vs such a tight and strong range.

with AK, perhaps your right, if we add QQ to his range its a call though, hard to tell from small sample size if a 20/0 would raise this PF, but from my experience, weak tight players like to limp/slowplay AA. So his range could be weighted towards QQ-KK

Yes, his range might be QQ-KK but do you really want to do a calldown for stacks if you hit being most likely behind? Better spot to call with 7 5 and play for good draws, two pair or better.

Question 11:
PartyPoker $10 NL Hold'em (10 handed)

Stacks & Stats
UTG ($10)
UTG+1 ($10) (20/0/1) [VPIP/PFR/AF]
UTG+2 ($10)
MP1 ($10)
MP2 ($10) (33/5/1/0.5) [VPIP/PFR/AF]
MP3 ($10) (15/12/3) [VPIP/PFR/AF]
CO ($10) (40/10/0.5) [VPIP/PFR/AF]
BU ($10)
Hero ($10)
BB ($10) (9/7/2) [VPIP/PFR/AF]
Preflop: Hero is SB with A , K
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.10, 4 folds, CO calls $0.10, 1 fold, Hero raises $0.70, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.70, CO calls $0.70

Flop: ($1.60) 4, 4, A (3 players)
Hero...?

Check/call (2 Points)
Check-raise (0 Points)
Bet/fold (0 Points)
Bet/3-bet (3 Points)
Bet/call (3 Points)

Your answer Bet/fold (0 Points)
Bet, bet, bet. You just can't let this hand go. 4x is still possible with such opponents, but weaker Ax-hands or even middle pairs are more likely and these are the ones that will pay you off.

With a board as drawless as this you can hardly go wrong. If your bet is raised you can even elect to call and postpone the real action to the turn.

Check/call is also possible (balancing shouldn't be necessarily an issue against such players), but the question remains if these players would barrel loosely enough. You would also have to anticipate a second barrel bet at the turn to justify a check.

You should keep in mind though that you want to keep the initiative while playing such kind of players and you don't want to regret on the river that the pot didn't turn out as big as you would have liked.

Hmm, 2 passive villain would raise with TPMK or MP?