BB vs UTG

nice hand. i like it as played.

if 86s is in your range of defense vs. open raise UTG is ok.

as played what I think is more profitable is raise turn, it does not have to be a big size so you can get a call from JJ QQ KK AA. Of course all sets will call until all in.
And playing on call turn, donkbet river. if they check behind you lose value.

does no one ever bluff at 2 NL, so that you dont have to worry about chasing them away w/ your turn raise?

I think check/calling the turn is a big mistake here. It makes it so easy for him to just check back the river with Tx, or even overpairs, and so hard for you to get stacks in.

I'm check-raising the turn and then betting the river.

hero has the nuts, right? i'm not sure what this "i think can shove if he 3bets the river" talk is about.
of course, it's basically impossible to misplay this. if you are playing against someone overly aggressive or in "very tough games" it makes sense to call turn, but in the vast majority of situations i'm raising the turn as well.

preflop isn't terrible, but this isn't in my defending range against utg 3x either.

Am I the only one here who check/raises the flop ?
Or at least the turn !
Come on bro. It's poker. Not a hippie game about peace and love. I know you have much tenderness in you but express it with MLima rather.

check/raising the flop is an option too, of course.
it just doesn't feel like we have too many value hands to rep, but this is definitely a bluff range candidate.

Check/raising flop seems like the best option.
Never fold OTR.

Thanks fellows.
I usually check raise OTF or OTT, it is my default line.
My line is that horrible? I think it maintain his range much wider and I look less strong then I am.
My check raise OTR could be nuts or total air imo. It puts more pressure on him I think.

the EV of the several lines w your actual holding should be very similar. it does not matter, when you put in the raise.

what matters though is how you play your range. you should have raises on every street; raises for value, raises as a bluff. when you dont, you will make your opponents life a lot easier.

so think about your range. think about your value combos, your draws, your air and distribute them over the possible lines. so make sure to have a flushdraw in your XC, XC, XC range as well as your XR, B, B and C, XR, B and your XC, XC, XR lines. do it for other categories as well and you will be fine.

Who x/c x/c x/r with total air here ? The field is very strong with that line so I don't see the point of waiting the river to try and value as you can both deny equity and make the pot bigger in case you win (the 2 reasons for raising) earlier. You have sets to raise as well and all.

Originally posted by MyFloXyBabY
Who x/c x/c x/r with total air here ?

you should do it w some AdXd and correspondingly w some AdXo. bluff =! air.

Originally posted by Pokamon

Originally posted by MyFloXyBabY
Who x/c x/c x/r with total air here ?

you should do it w some AdXd and correspondingly w some AdXo. bluff =! air.

Maybe but I'm talking about the fact that at NL2 it's the nutsy nuts line of most CS and known as such by most regs.

isnt that the best of all reasons to do it as a bluff yourself?

btw i was referring to a diamond river. on a blank river i do not know atm; havent run the sim.

most likely some 9x and 8x w/o diamonds. like T9ss, 87ss.

We all know this is micro stakes, players are generally weak, including me as an absolute donk and im not joking.
My hand here is a very strong draw OTF. Could be a check raise, could be a check call. How do you play vs 3bet? Call?
Turn we hit. Still can improve.
Check call flop and donk turn? I usually prefer to do this most of the times instead of check raise flop.
What about check raise turn and donk river line? Would be even stronger imo. A good player could fold a set to that imo. My bluffing range is very small in that case.
Floxy, imagine that villain is alexonmoon and tell me how you would play ahahah.

Originally posted by Pokamon
isnt that the best of all reasons to do it as a bluff yourself?

Sure but not the best reason to do is as a value as zeto. Pretty much anything that calls a river raise calls a raise before too.

I wouldn't expect much 3bets OTF and I guess we have to call depending on the odds and all.
Sure by raising the turn you are representing strong too. But stronger earlier is better when he doesn't call more after.

I'd probably give my BB to Alexonmoon here. Pure courtesy.
But if I chose to defend it pre I'm probably gonna x/r that combo OTF.

Originally posted by zetozinho
Check call flop and donk turn? I usually prefer to do this most of the times instead of check raise flop.

The thing is that check/raising flop is more likely to get paid by speculative hands than check/raising the turn. It also
makes the pot big enough so you can shove OTT if you hit.

If you get re-raised on the flop after you x/r then you have to evaluate what range he is willing to shove on the flop and calculate your all-in equity from there.

Yeah your obsession about the "Orient-Express play" is weird, check/raising is often better.
The call a street + donk the following is a subtle move that came back recently on some spots but I don't master it yet. It's not in the same spirit as yours anyway.