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Fold trips on flop?

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StVatle
Joined: 24.11.2014

Poker Stars, $0.02/$0.05 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

SB: $5.65 (113 bb)
BB: $5.07 (101.4 bb)
UTG: $5 (100 bb)
MP: $5.39 (107.8 bb)
CO: $5.37 (107.4 bb)
Hero (BTN): $5 (100 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BTN with J♥: Q♠:
UTG folds, MP raises to $0.12, CO folds, Hero raises to $0.40, SB calls $0.38, BB folds, MP calls $0.28

Flop: ($1.25) T♠: Q♦: Q♣: (3 players)
SB checks, MP checks, Hero bets $0.60, SB calls $0.60, MP raises to $4.99, Hero calls $4.00 and is all-in, SB folds

Turn: ($11.05) 9♦: (2 players, 1 is all-in)
River: ($11.05) 8♦: (2 players, 1 is all-in)

Results:

Spoiler

$11.05 pot ($0.46 rake)
Final Board: T♠: Q♦: Q♣: 9♦: 8♦:
SB mucked and lost (-$1 net)
MP showed T♥: T♣: and won $10.59 ($5.59 net)
Hero showed J♥: Q♠: and lost (-$5 net)

Hi guys!
If decided to fold this flop, would that be too nitty?

Thanks!


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10 replies
LordRonin
Joined: 10.02.2009

I think that would. Without any read would not fold trips here ever. Opponents line is soooo weird.


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Titicamara
Joined: 18.05.2009

Just a cooler. You still got outs.


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la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

TT is possible and there are some better Qx too. Since villain didn't 4bet pre, he likely doesn't have KK+ that he would overplay like this. So I don't see this as a bluff. Since he called our 3bet I don't see any weaker Qx either.
So what can he really have here except TT,KQ or AQ?


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MyFloXyBabY
Joined: 15.02.2010

A good proof that 3betting QJo BU vs MP isn't the idea of the year to say the least ;)
You just keep putting yourself into impossible spots with plays like that imo.

As played it should be impossible to fold, but at the same time la55i is making a point (even if I would add that I could very well see villains holds up JJ, AT, sometimes KK+ but not often yes, maybe QJ also, QTs...they can play so stupidly on paired flops in fact lol).


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scopinad
Joined: 13.06.2015

Originally posted by MyFloXyBabY
A good proof that 3betting QJo BU vs MP isn't the idea of the year to say the least ;)
You just keep putting yourself into impossible spots with plays like that imo

As played it should be impossible to fold, but at the same time la55i is making a point (even if I would add that I could very well see villains holds up JJ, AT, sometimes KK+ but not often yes, maybe QJ also, QTs...they can play so stupidly on paired flops in fact lol).

I agree, 3bet with QJo is awful.
As played, you get 2 to 1 on a call, with 4 outs.


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la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

Against 3x open I would fold this hand pre. I have dynamic ranges and they chance according to villains open size. We are in position so I like to keep more high equity hands in my range and flat with speculative hands since those benefit from better SPR and IP we can realize our equity better. So in position I like to have more merger range. Against 2.5x open I would expand my 3bet bluff range to QJo too. I don't think it is terrible. Our point is to get villain to fold pre, which they will do maybe even too often. If we play postflop wisely it shouldn't be a problem.


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Dadramel
Joined: 10.08.2014

Incorrectly placed 3bet pre-flop, nothing wrong with giving up


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YohanN7
Joined: 15.06.2009

Originally posted by StVatle
...
If decided to fold this flop, would that be too nitty?
...

No, it would be very, very wise. The decisive factors are that it is 3-ways, he raises as opposed to bets straight out (giving himself truly awful odds for a bluff), and you have many better hands to police the game with.


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Mozzek
Joined: 16.07.2016

I don´t 3bet QJ either. I think it´s cool as played. I don´t think villains will shove with nuts most of the time. It seems to me more like overplayed overpair. Of course we have to consider villain´s tendencies.


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la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

It is a 3bet pot, he is playing vs 2 and both seem to be interested in the pot. How likely is it that at least one of them has a Q? I think chances are ok, and probably any Qx will call his shove quite often. Also he might get calls from overpairs or combodraws. If villain shoves here with nuts, I don't think it is totally horrible and at the micros I would say you still see that kind of moves from time to time.

Also, overplaying overpairs on this board is possible but I don't think villain who doesn't 3bet KK+ will have that move in his arsenal.

If we want to give some slowplayed KK+ to him, I think 50% is absolute maximum he could have. That is 6 combos and TT,QT,KQ and AQ are 6 combos too. I still would say hero is likely behind and best case scenario is that he is splitting.


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