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QQ vs. passive player

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Dandiiik
Joined: 19.07.2009

MP is a passive 25/9 player. I really hate this spot. I 3bet QQ by default of course but in this case I was suspicious from the very beginning. He is passive and he opened from MP with 3,5 bbs. Decided to call and keep possible hands which I beat like AK in his range and play postflop. Flop is good so I go for a calldown but by river I was pretty sure I was beat by KK or AA, or even TT and JJ have set now. I didnt have a good session so I had to call and see it :f_biggrin:

Would you 3bet/shove preflop? I am afraid that in this spot I would always see KK+.


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VorpalF2F
Joined: 02.09.2010

If you treat this as a "way ahead way behind" hand, then according to this strategy article:
https://www.pokerstrategy.com/strategy/bss/on-flop-when-play-passively/
You played it correctly.

Cheers,
VS


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SDK1987
Joined: 12.11.2008

Even against a tight player I would 3bet most of the time for value or you have some sizing tells on him that he makes a smaller raise with weaker hands. Than I would fold if he 4bets.

Post-flop seems fine. Off course the run out isn't to great. Almost any weaker pair improved to full house on river that he would 3barrel. I don't expect he will play 33-77 and 99 like this. I don't think a fold on river isn't to bad with in mind you beat only a bluff and I doubt a passive villain will do this.

Cheers,
SDK1987


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zetozinho
Joined: 18.06.2017

3bet pre is my play vs MP. Call sometimes vs nits /really tight players (not the case).
If the runout doesn't contain an A, K, flushes etc you usually have to go broke.
Yeh, TT and JJ got there in the end. He should be aware that AA, KK must be careful on this runout, but he surely isn't.
You won't be exploited at low stakes by folding river, general pop doesn't triple barrel a hand like 65s, A9s.


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Casey55
Joined: 19.07.2010

I’m 3-betting pre, I don’t like playing good hands OOP without initiative hard to win money. River call is burning money seems like you are aware in hindsight.


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Dandiiik
Joined: 19.07.2009

Originally posted by Casey55
I’m 3-betting pre, I don’t like playing good hands OOP without initiative hard to win money. River call is burning money seems like you are aware in hindsight.

I agree with the OOP fact. I havent considered that actually. I like 3bet now more as well. What would be your plan if he 4bets? Go broke? I am afraid that this kind of player in these positions will have KK+ too often. Is 3bet/fold an option here?


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MLima1984
Joined: 19.05.2015

Im also more inclined to a 3bet and fold if villain 4bets.


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Casey55
Joined: 19.07.2010

Well because you listed your opponent as passive it makes life easier when he 4-bets, against a range of KK+ and AK you can fold confidently to a 4-bet. If villain was a LAG instead of a passive player I might call pre-flop because we can expect him to put the money into the pot for us, OOP it can be difficult to get the money in the pot without initiative and without giving away our hand strength for example at some point you would have to lead, check-raise or re-raise with your premium hands telling villain we have a strong hand whereas IP you Get the information from their actions first then you can act accordingly putting money in when you think it’s best and without giving away your hand strength as much in general.

When you take initiative and 3-bet pre OOP and they just call, most players are expecting you to c-bet small and frequently so it doesn't exactly give away your hand strength and it starts building the pot. When they do just call pre-flop it can give you more information about their hands also.


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