Multi-tabling 45-man Turbos

cryoburn - thank you for taking the time to give a very helpful and detailed response.

I shall try implementing the advice you have given me.

I've researched the software you have mentioned, and actually used the free 30 day trials of some, but I currently only wish to invest $100 in poker. That belongs to my playing bankroll for now at the 45-man $0.50 games.

I will probably want to wait until I hit $300 before investing in EITHER SnGWiz or HM. However, I'm not sure what would be best to go for at that stage.

Then hopefully, after more BR building, I will be able to move up to the $1.50 45 Mans.

Right now, my tools are:
1. Equilab
2. ICM Trainer
3. Universal Replayer
4. Holdem Resources Calculator (not really sure if this brings anything extra?)
5. Fortunately, stumbled upon a free HUD, so I am able to see Vpip and Pfr, but will have to tweak it somehow to display the ones you recommended...*
*It really would be good if I could somehow filter stats depending on what state the tournament was at... Don't know how I'd do this.

So, I'll just have to squeeze all the value and help I can out of these for now...

Also, I sometimes find it difficult to make a note on a player when multi-tabling, and I'm not sure how I note a player after the game.

Again, thanks for your advice!

With a $100 investment I would definetly use it for BR only.

I think you're good with 200BI for the 50c 45mans having some good fundamentals on sngs and poker in general. And only later invest on some software. I'd recommend starting with HM2 as soon as you can confortably affort to buy it as it will be good to study your game and regulars.
As for TableNinja2 there's also a 60 day trial.

In terms of studying you should watch Colin Moshman's videos and coachings. And read "Kill Everyone".

Downswings are unavoidable, so be prepared for them, take a couple of days off if it's affecting your focus.

Post and discuss hands on the forums.

Regarding notes on opponents:
- prefer to take notes on regular players (with more HH)
- for note taking while reviewing your session I guess you'd need HM...
- reduce nr of tables to improve note taking
- use color coding (I assume you're playing at Stars), get a system for that (ie. a specific color for good regs, another for maniacs, etc.)

Any doubts, keep posting!

Originally posted by cryoburn
With a $100 investment I would definetly use it for BR only.

I think you're good with 200BI for the 50c 45mans having some good fundamentals on sngs and poker in general. And only later invest on some software. I'd recommend starting with HM2 as soon as you can confortably affort to buy it as it will be good to study your game and regulars.
As for TableNinja2 there's also a 60 day trial.

In terms of studying you should watch Colin Moshman's videos and coachings. And read "Kill Everyone".

Downswings are unavoidable, so be prepared for them, take a couple of days off if it's affecting your focus.

Post and discuss hands on the forums.

Regarding notes on opponents:
- prefer to take notes on regular players (with more HH)
- for note taking while reviewing your session I guess you'd need HM...
- reduce nr of tables to improve note taking
- use color coding (I assume you're playing at Stars), get a system for that (ie. a specific color for good regs, another for maniacs, etc.)

Any doubts, keep posting!

cryoburn

I've actually been reading a ton of poker books. Probably the kind that aren't too applicable to 45-man turbos, but knowledge is knowledge. I recently finished 'Kill Phil' after beginning to read 'Kill Everyone' in which it advised me to start with the Phil former.

Also have a friend who subscribed to sit and go grinders and has a tonne of 45 man turbo videos from 'tigerbalm'. I think they're super useful but POSSIBLY outdated...

I know, downswings *sigh*. I genuinely think my reaction to them is my biggest weakness. I mean, anybody can learn the technical side to perfection, but if you're not in control.. you get what I'm trying to say.

I've taken on board what you say about the helpfulness of the analysis software and I've taken the plunge for HM2 anyway. I see it as an investment that I will see some returns from and accelerate my learning.

Thanks for the advice.

At the cost of looking like a total jerk, I just have to ask this question:

quote:
Originally posted by Lazza61
If I key in 25% VPiP into PokerStrategy's Equilab (free), I get this hand range.

66+, A2s+, K6s+, Q8s+, J8s+, T8s+, A7o+, K9o+, QTo+, JTo

It's a great tool for assigning ranges based on VPiP and it's available for free download.

Whereas in SNGWiz, 66+ is in the category with AJo and stuff like that, while even 22+ is 22.5% range. Do I have a dated wiz? Am I just plain stupid ? What's going on ?

Originally posted by M3lchior
At the cost of looking like a total jerk, I just have to ask this question:

quote:
Originally posted by Lazza61
If I key in 25% VPiP into PokerStrategy's Equilab (free), I get this hand range.

66+, A2s+, K6s+, Q8s+, J8s+, T8s+, A7o+, K9o+, QTo+, JTo

It's a great tool for assigning ranges based on VPiP and it's available for free download.

Whereas in SNGWiz, 66+ is in the category with AJo and stuff like that, while even 22+ is 22.5% range. Do I have a dated wiz? Am I just plain stupid ? What's going on ?

Hey M3lchior,

First of all never ever be afraid to ask anything at all. Even if think you think it sounds silly. Not only because its one of the best ways to learn, but also because you shouldn't mind what other people think of you and what you say or do at anytime.

Regarding your question:

The % represents the total number of hands you consider to be in someone's range. It is your assessment of the opponent's range.

Let's take an example. If you know your opponent openraises UTG specifically and only with [99+, AQs+, AQo+] you get a total combination of 68 of hands (from a total of possible 1326 hands in holdem), or 5.13% of that total. (If 1326 is 100% of hands, then 68 hands is 5.13%).

But you can obtain the exact 5.13% if you select hands other than those I mentioned. So, for the sake of argument, you can get 5.13% with this range: [77-22, 42s, 32s, 42o, 32o].

We can conclude then that a % doesn't mean a specific set of hands, but rather the hands you think that could be in that %.
And that's why you can get different hand ranges with different %.

You should never type in a number in the % textbox in any software. You should rather make an assessment of the opponents range first.

I'll give you a more realistic example in terms of hand ranges.
You look at your opponent's stats (with a decent hand sample) and see that he has a 24% PFR in CO.
You could say that you believe that he has a certain number of hands, from your experience and from what you've seen him showing down:
[22+, A2s+, KTs+, A2o+, KTo+]

But that doens't necessarily mean your assessment is correct. In fact he could raise less small Kx, Ax, or small pocket pairs, and rather sometimes raise some suited connectors and some Qx or Jx for instance.

So the interpretation of what hands make up a % depends on the player. And it is up to you to make that assessment.

Hope I made it clear!

This looks like the magic well of mtsng.

I've been playing that a bit myself, but found it a bit annoying to be "locked" in for a specific amt of time a 1st place takes to get in a regular speed 45m-180m mtsng.

When u get to final 5 players on finaltable. Use the hud to filter that stats for 5, 4, 3 and hu so. Make it as some kind of shorcut since this is very helpful, very +ev, and very unprecise and useless unless u have a big sample on 3-5 regs that sits with u.

Also filter ur stats on ppls bb. Like ex 1-4, 3-6, 5-7, 6-8, 7-9, 8-10, 11-13, 14-17, 18-24, 25-32, 33-44, 45-60, 61-95, 96+
Or what ever suits u in terms of filtering and how u see the game chances compared to stacksize. And how some regs have huge leaks that gets easy to spot using filtering in stats, which can be misleading, UNLESS u have played 10k+ hands with another reg. Then u know enough if u say u have understanded icm/nash to perfection - to very quickly find leaks in the opp that u have a lot of hands on.

But that would mean u would stay @ 0.5$ 45m mtsng during like 10k hands on the reg u have most hands on, which mean u would have played something like? idk 5k mtsngs? 50k hands of 0.5$ mtsng45m? if we say the reg u know also plays 14+ tables and sees u frequently about 20% of the time? And you SHOULD only get so many hands on a reg in mtsng when u play max stakes or something. And then again, that is also hard because of the traffic. So dont really know if this is usefull since u prob have moved up like 5-10 times during those mtsngs.

I can tell u how wonderfull it is with 9m sngs ♦

Some good stuff in here, is the Op still around, "Knock knock, any body home "

Steve

I personally think SNG wizz is a little outdated, i prefere holdem resources for 45 man turbo,s - purchase the software its very cheap imo, it has a more indepth look into certain plays like FGS (Future Game Simulation) wich if used correctly will open your eyes, it will give you good push/fold/call ranges.