Those who manage to balance poker and relationships are heroes... but it seems to me that success in poker (which requires 99-100% dedication) can be so fulfilling (if the body is well fuelled and fit so that it doesn't interfere with the flight of the mind) that sex is no longer needed 
(Maybe that's because I never really needed it - contrary to my long-time beliefs imposed by the society - and can't understand those who're craving.)
Notifications
Clear all
General Poker Discussion
52
Posts
18
Users
0
Reactions
9,333
Views
By far the biggest difference in my relationship with my gf with poker was when i started winning. When i was struggling she was the typical annonying gf, but then she saw i suddenly have money and saw my BR on the cashier when it reached a certaion point. Now we never have problems when it comes to poker. She understands i have to play, and doesn't bother me when i do.
So it's simple: just start crushing ♦
Regards,
Skod
Originally posted by Skodljivec
By far the biggest difference in my relationship with my gf with poker was when i started winning. When i was struggling she was the typical annonying gf, but then she saw i suddenly have money and saw my BR on the cashier when it reached a certaion point. Now we never have problems when it comes to poker. She understands i have to play, and doesn't bother me when i do.So it's simple: just start crushing ♦
Regards,
Skod
This!
@Charlie
I'm going to take a look at your blog, if it's as lengthy as what you're writing now I'm sure I'll have a lot of toilet reading in the future!
I really like the last little tale of the Tibetan monk. I think there is a lot to be learned from that
@tony
I need to have both my friend, in fact, I would deffo argue that my winnings went up the more I had sex. It felt like I carried an emotional buzz that just led to play like I was unstoppable
@Skoddy
Hahaha I've been winning for just over a year now solidly, not crushing my limits though 
Maybe you should give me some free coaching on my past sessions(It's PLO) :)))))))
Well written post Charlie, once i saw that link to your blog i remembered that i have read your blog a while back too and than i realized that it sounded quite familiar as i have read Zen and the art of the poker and i believe that there were another one about archery too, great stuff, prob should reread it, as a lot has changed since i read it last time, prob will find something new.
Here is the link for the one i had in my bookmarks.
http://www.gamblingsystem.biz/books/Phillips_Zen_and_the_art_of_poker.pdf
Charlie, can you recommend some of the books you have read, it don't necessary needs to be about poker.
That book, I mean, wow. Sometimes in life you find something that's been around all along and you just have to think to yourself how you haven't found it before. This is the axact kind of thing that I'm searching for. I mean, it perfectly matches mind to poker actions.
If anyone is reading this and considering reading 'Zen and the art of Poker', just do it, don't even contemplate it. Seriously good stuff.
Mass tabling made all the anxiety I had in me bubble up, and maybe create a bit more.
After about 3months of 100MTTs+/day I started talking to myself more and after about 6months it got to a weird point of not undestanding who is talking in my head and with who (depersonalisation).
I'm also less able to focus now. So what I found out is that I basically was anxious all my life and this thing is fixable, not just my weird way of being.
So what I think is that auditory thinkers (that is thinking in speech) will probably have issues at some point with grinding long hours in solitude.
Fantastic book for this is "At last a life". Hope it helps!
Charlie, i just read your whole blog, i feel like fish now. (but here are my 2 cents) ♦
I had few questions while i read it, but they just dropped out of my mind once i started to write, but one i still got - One of your next blog posts needs to be about your journey in Japan, okey it is not the question, but you can get the idea, i don't want to limit your story, just tell what you feel free to share with us, it will def be a good read.
I just cant believe that you are not good at multitabling, with that kind of knowledge and mindset you can learn anything and be able to crush the games you are playing and move up with quite fast pace. On the other hand prob there is a reason why you don't want to do it.
After reading your blog and posts in here, one thing - you worry too much about the stuff you cant control, in poker terms you are being results oriented, it seemed to me like you want people to like you too much and if they will like your posts and ideas they will like you, but from my experience it has nothing to do with that, i might me wrong but there prob are to groups people who will like it or the people who don't care. Given the fact that all of your posts are that long 2nd group won't even go past your first post.
Feedback is always a good thing, but negative feedback sometimes is much more useful than positive one, but it feels to me that if you wouldn't give a sh**t about the readers, just ramble in your way, you will be able to express yourself a bit better and we will be just enjoying your thoughts.
Originally posted by ShadDoneWin
If anyone is reading this and considering reading 'Zen and the art of Poker', just do it, don't even contemplate it. Seriously good stuff.
I found that book a while ago but stopped reading it after the first few pages - it advocates nitty play, doesn't it?
HolyF*ck man. So I just typed the title into google and came across the official site http://www.anxietynomore.co.uk/at_last_a_life.html . Reading over the long list of things people inhibit with the problems, I struggled to find one that I didn't very very strongly relate to. Today, no matter what, I will read this book and report back to everyone what I think of it.
I really hope you deal with your demons, your problem of depersonalisation is something I was always desperately hoping not to gain. Keep up the good work and with some hope you overcome the issue.
@Rufus
After reading this I was inspired to read Charlie's blog. Charlie, write about Japan. Now. I also fully agree with Rufus, you could deffo multi table, you see like a very smart man.
@tony
I think you've got the wrong book man, there is actually a lot more on mindset than pokerstrat. I hope you don't find this belittling, but after reading this quote I had to laugh to myself as I read you reply
Get the facts, or the facts will get you.
—Thomas Fuller
ahhaa, it was actually in the book which gives it a weird irony. Maybe it's a weird deterministic ripple demonstrating that, in fact, you should read the book.
To all, I think this thread has some super valuable information. I'd love to create a new thread that isn't about me, that everyone can use. Like a sticky with all the resources where people can give anecdotes and advise, to which hopefully more of the community will benefit.
Originally posted by UPAY4DINNER
Originally posted by Skodljivec
By far the biggest difference in my relationship with my gf with poker was when i started winning. When i was struggling she was the typical annonying gf, but then she saw i suddenly have money and saw my BR on the cashier when it reached a certaion point. Now we never have problems when it comes to poker. She understands i have to play, and doesn't bother me when i do.So it's simple: just start crushing ♦
Regards,
Skod
This!
+1
I had big downswing in last 6month and a lot of frustrations because of this which reflects on my gf and life. So i thought poker and money is not worth it, and did self exclusion for 2months, and when self exclusion ended i played again, but very fast i did self exclusion again. So i realized when i dont play poker i feel much better, and my gf. By the way poker causes a lot of stress, problems with family, friends, health. Is the fun and money really worth it? In my case it is not worth it. I still didnt stop playing completely, i play once a week when my gf is not at home and when i have plenty of time, but i hope to quit it completely.
THat really looks demotivating esp from black member. I hope that everything is not so true as you said and poker can be good. 6 month downswing - is it that likely to happen? Maybe you were most unlucky person. Of course what was the volume?
I also remember Oblio saying something like - I can work part time and have money as working full time.
So just need to manage those bad periods. Also why not moving down the limit which you crush while on the bad period to make you feel better, as we know when we are on limit which we crush, its less likely we be on downswing, partly because we will be less money scared. I am not sure with your experience should you be money scared at all, unless you play with agro BRM.
And so if you can work part time and have money as full time, you have tons of time to talk to gf, friends and so on - can it be better ever?
Originally posted by ShadDoneWin
@tonyI think you've got the wrong book man, there is actually a lot more on mindset than pokerstrat.
No, I read that same book up to chapter 2 'Folding', where the claim that folding (~nittiness) is Zen caused my disgust as I respect Zen much more than folding 
Perhaps I should read a bit more of the book.
Originally posted by Skodljivec
By far the biggest difference in my relationship with my gf with poker was when i started winning. When i was struggling she was the typical annonying gf, but then she saw i suddenly have money and saw my BR on the cashier when it reached a certaion point. Now we never have problems when it comes to poker. She understands i have to play, and doesn't bother me when i do.So it's simple: just start crushing ♦
Regards,
Skod
That's the heroism I was talking about. In a real romantic relationship (or friendship alike), as I understand the concept, the partner should be supportive in bad times too, not only good ones. (They say: to become a general's wife, a woman must marry a lieutenant.) Otherwise I'd feel entitled to treat the partner as if I were a piece of furniture, like GingerKid suggested.
Being a Black Member is one of my goals, it is pretty demoralizing to see one wanting to actually get away from the life
Your idea of moving down for him is a good idea, only if he only plays poker for the money and recreation. Like, if he's anything like me, most of poker is about the challenge and just straight up being better than other people. If that's the case, moving down may not be the best idea.
Maybe, instead, how about playing with like a 200BI br, just being super safe at all times? I know if I was playing on my limit with $40k and would feel a lot happier about life.
@Tony
For sure read that chapter again but with an open mind. I think you could interpret it a bunch of different ways. For me it was more of a live thing.
I remember playing a 1/2 NL game at the Vic about 4 months ago and on my table was a Vegas grinder who was supposed to be pretty good. In London most regs are actually quite loose, but this guy was super tight. He would somehow loosen up in the perfect spots and just seemed to win every hand. I remember he won like a 140BB hand of me then for the next 2 hours I was chasing him, he was just calmly folding like 70%-85% of hands and was more than willing to wait. After waking up the next morning I realised how powerful simply folding can be and also how much it can tilt the fu** out of other players 
Great to see how this thread continues to offer some excellent food for thought! And thank you Rufus and Shad for your words of encouragement. I will definitely consider writing some more Japanese related stuff on my blog as it's always something that's close to my heart.
Although as much as I am flattered by your kind words about your writing, whether that then translates to me being able to crush any table - multi or otherwise - alas is perhaps not the case 
At least not yet. I fear I have a lot more training to do on other parts of my brain for that to happen!
And yes, I chose the name of the blog as a kinda tribute to that book. I can see why it could be seen as advocating a more nitty approach but as Shad says, it's more about the power that can come from a seemingly weak move. The best samurai were always the ones who knew when to step back as much as when to strike. That way your opponent can be drained of power and energy while getting more and more frustrated and you just step calmly out of the way....until the moment comes to hit hard ♠_evil:
Oh and just before logging in, I saw an article earlier which seems to be very appropriate considering our original discussions about the inability to sit alone with our thoughts. As the study seems to show, people - and specifically men - would rather electrocute themselves than sit quietly. Alas, they didn't research the even more interesting subject of how many of us would rather electrocute someone else ♠_cool: But for that subject you better read my blog post about being a psychopath 
@Shad That's an interesting story about your play against the Vegas shark. I am so envious of anyone who is able to play live as for me that will always be the purest form of our game. But then I am always a lover of trad in whatever I do
And if you're in London much and fancy a pint to talk zen and poker then drop me a line. Would be great to get to know some players offline....
@Rufus You asked about what I am reading at the moment. It's actually quite suitable for this discussion as it's in the field of mind training. Do you know anything about lucid dreaming? Where you try to become aware within a dream that you're dreaming? And then try to shape the environment and course of the dream. I've been to a couple of workshops with a guy who's big in the discipline called Charlie Morley and his book is pretty good.
And although he comes from a Tibetan Buddhist background - where lucid dreaming is very much a part of the tradition - it's actually nothing woo or magical. It's simply about training and exploring the power of our minds and subconscious and then using that to do....well, whatever we want to do but with the total freedom of our dreamscape. And most importantly it can be a lot of fun! As Charlie says, most people when they lucid dream end up doing one of two things - flying or fucking And some of us even do both at the same time
So that's something that is interesting me a lot recently. And I still smile at Charlie's bemused expression when he asked me at the last workshop what I would do if I became lucid in my dreams..."Play perfect poker of course!" 
I checked it out.While reading an interview what he did a bit before his book came out, i realized that i have been lucid dreaming for past few years to be honest.... ♦ you know what i mean. ♦ But i wasn't aware of the fact that it is something special or there is a word for it, i just figured its quite cool that i can shape my dreams however i want and if i can than probably everyone is doing it. When i come lucid in my dreams nowadays its nothing new, so everything seems as usual and i can escape the dreams that i don't like and shape the one i like in my way.
I remember some of the lucid dreams about playing poker, at the beginning it was quite scary as i was aware in sense that i was in the dream, but it felt so real, i had a feeling that i wasn't in total control of my actions, so i automatically knew i wasn't playing my best game and the tought that this might not be a dream scared me quite a lot.. ♦ So my defense mechanism turned on and i tried to get out of these dreams, but as Charlie Morley suggests, you need to embrace these dreams, so will see how it goes next time, maybe i will win some tournaments there. ♦
Here is his ted talk few years back
Thanks Charlie, i def will try to look deeper into lucid dreaming and i will try to get that book.
I agree that probably you have a lot of things to do to be able to crush the game, you will need to train yourself in different areas of the game, but i have the feeling that you might not see the actual value of how important your mindset and all the lessons you have learned is in today's game.
I feel like nowadays there are a lot of players that is studying the game theory but dont see that they will not reach their maximum without the mental game both of them goes hand in hand, and until they realize the value and importance of the mental game of poker they will feel stuck and will hold themselves back. I know that there are guys out there that have never picked up a book about it or really study it, but they are beating the game, there could be a lot of reasons, but i feel like the reason is because they just isn't aware of the things they do, they have home schooled themselves to deal with mental game on their own in their way.
Embrace the studying process and put in the work and results will follow.
Originally posted by tonypmm
Originally posted by Skodljivec
By far the biggest difference in my relationship with my gf with poker was when i started winning. When i was struggling she was the typical annonying gf, but then she saw i suddenly have money and saw my BR on the cashier when it reached a certaion point. Now we never have problems when it comes to poker. She understands i have to play, and doesn't bother me when i do.So it's simple: just start crushing ♦
Regards,
Skod
That's the heroism I was talking about. In a real romantic relationship (or friendship alike), as I understand the concept, the partner should be supportive in bad times too, not only good ones. (They say: to become a general's wife, a woman must marry a lieutenant.) Otherwise I'd feel entitled to treat the partner as if I were a piece of furniture, like GingerKid suggested.
Well the problem is of course that poker is frowned upon by the community. And if you think about it, for good reason. We all know a lot of players that like to just upload their 50$ online, open a nl50 table, and "gamble it up". They are proud to tell everyone they are poker players, but just sort of unlucky overall.
So it's hard for someone to understand the professional approach to poker. And they only understand it when you start making money.
I believe my gf was basically thinking i was doing the same things as if i was playing video games for a big part of the day, so nothing productive. I would also talk about poker all the time, and especially the bad beats at nl25 were brutal in my mind ♦.
You have to look at it from both perspectives. The whole concept of a gf having to be supportive when we struggle on micro's is misguided imo. Sure it would be great, but to their minds this is just a video game where more often than not you will be loosing money ♦
So long story short, it's hard to really assess what the perfect companion should be in this cases. It's much easier to marry a luitenant who's path you know where it leads. 95% poker players bust, so it's hard to project sureness of success to your so if you aren't sure you won't be in that 95% yourself.
Regards,
Skod
Originally posted by Skodljivec
You have to look at it from both perspectives. The whole concept of a gf having to be supportive when we struggle on micro's is misguided imo. Sure it would be great, but to their minds this is just a video game where more often than not you will be loosing money ♦
That's why I say that regs should sublime 100% of their sex drive into improving at poker [except for those lucky few who have poker coaches in their beds] at least until they start making money. It applies to getting to the top on any other career path too, except that it's mandatory to be in the top 20% to make money at all in poker, while in other professions the percentage of people making at least some money is much higher.
The relationship stories I read on poker forums tilt me a lot. We, players, are not just bloody money bags, we have souls too.
The biggest mistake partners of poker players, and other sportsmen and scientists alike, make is disturbing us when we're in the flow. They don't have to understand what exactly we're doing in the zone, but they should respect our temporary isolation there and put their real-life concerns off until we return to the life.
My math colleague once bragged that, after only a few years of marriage, his wife was perfectly able to recognise the moments when he was thinking about math. She doesn't understand what he thinks about because her degree is in philology, but she doesn't interfere with his perfect working atmosphere when inspiration visits him.
To conclude, let me tell a story about Nadezhda Smyslova, the wife of a world chess champion. When she was asked how well she played chess, she answered that she didn't play chess at all, but nevertheless understood the positions her husband was in. When GM Mark Taimanov heard about this, he shook his head in sorrow and confessed that it was the other way round for him: he did play chess, but often couldn't understand the position...
So I wish partners of those poker players who do want to have them at all could understand the position perfectly!
Wow this thread guys. I had it open for so long but started reading just an hour or so ago. One of the most interesting topics in a while, for sure.
Let me first say that I'm sorry for all your poker/life struggles. Hope you resolve them as quickly as possible and who knows... maybe my 2 cents in this thread will help too. Probably not, but can't hurt to try
The funniest thing is that I was just writing a blogpost for PokerStarsblog.com with a title called "How I stay sharp at poker", which includes many things from this thread. Unfortunately, I changed the theme to something else (football lol) and will be posting the above mentioned blog in August. Will post the link here, but for now I'll just do a quick summary.
Poker stuff
For me, the first and the most important thing is, to distance poker from your "real life" and/or relationship. I really can't stress enough how important this is for me.
I'm playing poker for ~10 years now and have a GF of ~7 years. She doesn't know the rules, she never heard not one of my bad beat stories, we basically never talk about poker ever. Well that's not entirely true, we talk about poker, because it's just too big part of my life to not talk about, but we surely don't talk about stuff that "matters". Let me just draw a picture of how well she knows poker... A month or so ago she read one of my blogposts and after it she asked me: "Honey.... What's river at poker?" Yep, that clueless
I told her that she should never ask me "how did the session go" or something like that. Of course I explained her why that is and how short-term results don't matter and stuff like that. She maybe asks me few times a year how am I doing and I always say OK, no matter what. She also knows that I'm "off-line" (off-life? ♦) during my sessions. I may look like a furniture when playing (as GingerKid mentioned) but she understands.
Saying all that, you clearly need to have an understanding girlfriend. To be honest I have no idea how hard that is, it's possible that I'm just very lucky to have her.
Basically I never bring my work home. When I finish my session and when I close my last poker software, I also stop thinking about poker. When I say that to people I usually get a question "But was there ever a hand that baffled you so much that you couldn't stop thinking about it?". Pretty simple answer to that - nope. I think about poker and hands when I do session reviews. And when I close HM, poker almost doesn't exists anymore. I was never ever in my life in a bad mood for more than a few minutes because of poker and I had my fair share of bad beats and downswings, believe me. My GF never knows if I won or lost 1000$ that session/day. In fact, even I don't know, because I never look at the results I look at them once a month, but I wouldn't even do that if I weren't blogging.
Now that I read what I actually wrote I see that's not entirely what you were looking for. My point here was pretty simple (execution may be hard tho)... Distance poker from everything else in your life. Don't look at the session results if you can't deal with swings, don't think about poker hands. Make a schedule and reserve few hours of the week for session reviews and do thinking then. Don't share bad beats with others. When you stop playing, make a cut. How can you do that? I guess you have to do something that is stress-free and calming right after you finish your session. Yoga? Meditations? Crosswords? Reading a book?
Basically, you can do both - poker and life. Just need a bit of planning, training and whatnot.
Non-poker stuff
This will be pretty short on how I "stay sharp" with non-poker-y stuff.
- puzzles
I do lots of (Japanese) pencil puzzles. Those really soothe me, especially the ones that you have to draw or color stuff. I mean I also do puzzles with numbers (Kakuro, Fillomino, ...), but I prefer moving my pencil more ♦ I hate Sudoku.
- reading a book
I think this one is pretty self-explanatory. Of course it has to be something that interests me.
- cooking
Cooking is really good as you have to follow the rules (recipe) to succeed. Well... When you are experienced enough you can go more "freestyle", but with baking, you really have to do stick to what the recipe is saying.
- games
Games are (usually) not soothing of course, but they help to blow off steam. Same as with poker, I don't have long gaming sessions. Max 2 hours.
- jogging
Very relaxing and rewarding.
- football
Opposite of jogging, blowing off steam. But after 1,5 hour of running, adrenaline rushes and tons of sprints I'm really exhausted and that's just a perfect combination for my mind and body.
- board games
Playing board games (and other games *wink* *wink)* with my GF. That's really a win-win situation.
That will be it for now. I wanted to address some more stuff but I'll do it later, especially if I get some replies/questions or something. Maybe after reading this you'll think that I'm not a multitasker at all, but I really am. I just learned to control it... Basically it came naturally to me. Just for an example, as you mentioned Breaking Bad. For me that show is going waaay to slow and I had to watch it on a bigger speed than normal so that I could stay focused. I got so used to it now that I'm basically watching all TV dramas (and some other stuff) on 130% speed lol (100% being a normal speed). Just for the record, this obviously is not a solution
GL