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K6o BB

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gnananandan
Joined: 24.06.2013

Poker Stars, $0.25/$0.50 Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players

Preflop: Hero is BB with 6 K
UTG calls, 3 folds, SB completes, Hero checks

Flop: (3 SB) 5 J 8 (3 players)
SB bets, Hero calls, UTG calls

Turn: (3 BB) 9 (3 players)
SB bets, Hero calls, UTG folds

River: (5 BB) 8 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

SB: 82/0/0
I have some 6 outs approx. on Turn & calling is not correct.
May be Bluffraise Turn here? But he never gona fold any pair or A high or may be K high too


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4 replies
Dawnfall26
Joined: 30.07.2008

Hi!

Why would you call flop with air and not even completing the action? Flop is a clear fold. You are getting 1:4 and even slightly worse since guy behind you will sometimes raise...at the same time your outs dont rly have good implied odds,in fact hitting 6 will do more harm than good.

Turn as played fold is basically the same. Not good enough odds and not even closing the action.

River no need to bet.


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firsttsunami
Joined: 23.01.2006

No offense but your Flopcall is just terrible. Even if you'd gotten 1:11, it's still a fold. Raise or unraised Pot in this matter doesn't make a difference since the 6 is no out at all and on Kx and bd-Flushdraw you can count 3-4 Outs but lets optimistically count 4 Outs for your hand, you need to have 1:11. Raising the Turn is no option but it's still a clear fold as it was on the flop. You just get dragged in deeper and deeper with still a marginal hand and i think you would have even continued on 6 on the Turn although its no out but you talk yourself into etc.

K♣9♠ in a raised Pot you might peel on the Flop but not this hand for 1:4 odds!


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gnananandan
Joined: 24.06.2013

I know i am not getting enough outs to call on Flop. But i thought i could peel one due to the BDFD. So do you say its only OK to peel in a raised Flop with BDFD?

Then i hit on Turn a gutshot. I never counted the "6".
So my outs on Turn after discounting- 3 for Gutshot+2.5 for K. So its 5.5 outs and i got something like 1:7. Still bad for a Call(pot odds 1:4). But what i was wondering is whether i could Raise here as a Semibluff??


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firsttsunami
Joined: 23.01.2006

There are some situations where the additional bd-flushdraw can be the decisive factor but you have to distinguish between a good bd-Flushdraw like second or nutflushdraw and flushdraws like T and 9 high. It adds up another 1,5 Outs and lets say the pot would have been raised and you'd hold K♣9♠ then the bd-Flushdraw becomes important or you have A9 or AT with A♣ and you are torn between folding and calling given a raised pot and odds of 1:7 to call but not 1:4.

I'd recommend you to read the odds and outs article again in the silver section. It takes you while to be able to evaluate the amount of outs properly and get an idea of how many often your outs will be good enough to win the showdown and how often they are tainted and not worthwhile chasing like in this case where you counted the 6 as some out but it brings you more trouble than it might help you.

bd-Flushdraw becomes important when you have 6 undiscounted Outs to the 2 bottom cards ot the board but even in a raised pot it's not worth calling A♣3♦ when you get 1:7 and you are in the sandwitch position. Closing the action and in a heads-up Situation you can peel once but your pairouts decrease in value the more people being still around.

With odds of 1:4 that you got in this hand you require eleven outs and you dont have by far 11 outs but rather 3 outs or so. And there is another concept of implied odds that means the more you think you'll win by hitting your hand the worse your odds can be. It means if you have a draw like QT on this board and you count 4 outs to your gutshot and 3 Outs to T and Q to be good. Means you have 7 outs in total and you require Pot odds of 1:6 to call on 7 Outs. Imagine you just get 1:4 you can call though since you'll close this gap by winning the 2 missing BB on a later street- on Turn or River.

Whenever you have a Gutshot or some weak draw but thats aiming to draw to the nuts, you can be more liberal with the immidiate odds you're getting for the sake of collection quite a lot money if you improve with the 9 to the nutstraight.

There are many situations where the bd-Flushdraw can be the decisive factor but it just comes on top of the fact that you can count on your pairouts more than you can count on the outs to the bd-flushdraw. its a nice addition that gives you another 1,5 outs but the call is more based on the chance of winning by hitting a pair.

You may post some examples where you're not sure if the bd-Flushdraw is enough to justify proceeding or whether its not enough.


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