3bet pot facing aggresion

PF you 3 bet for value or as a bluff? And what will you do vs a raise?

for value of course. fold vs raise

If you are going to fold, is it for value then?
Now let'sget to the flop: write down villain's raising range.

i'd say its a fold for sure at the flop when he raises, his range is basically AA, AK, A9, 99, A3, 33, AJ, AQ MAYBE AT if hes a huge fish

Now that I think about it a3 and a9 are very unlikely after he calls 3bet pf. I'd say hes got either 33/99 AJ/AQ/AK or a bluff depending on what you know about him.

Originally posted by nitrol
If you are going to fold, is it for value then?
Now let'sget to the flop: write down villain's raising range.

Of course it is for value. If you raise AQ for value then face a reraise do you have to go for the stack with the hand just because you initial raised for value? I don`t think so..

Give flop raising range...

when i 3bet AQ it's normally a bluff with good blockers to AA AK AQ and QQ unless against a huge fish, if this is a huge fish then you shud of just shoved on flop cus he can have all kinds of aces even something like QQ KK or JJ and just gets mad that there is A on flop lol

BB seems to be more aggressive so I like the 3bet, folding to a 4bet. Flop: I think that the only combos you beat are some :diamond:connectors. If you want to stay in the hand why not pushing otf?

Villains rainge otf: 99,33,AKs,KdQd,QdJd,JdTd,Td9d,9d8d,8d7d,7d6d,6d5d,AKo. Do you agree with that?

Nitrol what range of hands would you flat from CO vs a SB 3bet? Without going into too many details about "vs what kind of opponent?". If you would respond "vs who?" then:

1) unknown
2) standard TAG reg
3) standard fish (not too active not too passive; not nitty to be 3betting only the nuts but not aggro to be 3betting complete shit all the time)

@ Vip3rNZ and VaskataBuci: why do you both include AK in your CO flatting range vs a SB 3bet? You really think villains aren't 4betting these preflop?? Of course there's no way of knowing for sure but it feels like your assumptions are that most villains are nits, no?

1) JJ-99, AQs-AJs, AQo, KQs- call me a nit
2) JJ-99, AQs-ATs, AQo-AJo, KQs
3) add KJs, JTs-T9s, KQo to 2)

Originally posted by VaskataBuci
BB seems to be more aggressive so I like the 3bet, folding to a 4bet. Flop: I think that the only combos you beat are some :diamond:connectors. If you want to stay in the hand why not pushing otf?

Villains rainge otf: 99,33,AKs,KdQd,QdJd,JdTd,Td9d,9d8d,8d7d,7d6d,6d5d,AKo. Do you agree with that?

Yes. I think I should have pushed on the flop.

Set mining is not profitable from CO`s perspective but it doesn`t mean he does realize it. We are beat after this huge flop raise and should fold as a standart play IMO. I`ve seen tons of opponents call a 13bb squeeze and reraise my AA confidently postflop just to see he put 20% of his stack with 22 preflop. Analyzing lines is sometimes better then analyzing range.

3betting should be fine as part of 3bet-only strat from the SB against the CO
Our move against the 4bet depends on his sizing imo - but i would mostly call unless villains 4bets very nitty

flop bet is fine - we are basically trying to bet 3 streets for value here (AA,AK he shouldnt have, 33 A3s should be very unlikely)
His raise is very confusing and does not seem to be a good rangeplay - but whatever
Calling the raise seems to be the way to go - he is most likely polarized to 99,A9s - and random flushdraws or sth if he is playing AJ like this we are unlikely to loose value by calling
Turnplay makes sense if you fear c/backs from his flushdraws but expect them to call it off
however you usually want to check to a polarized range when you hold a bluffcatcher

Originally posted by nitrol
1) JJ-99, AQs-AJs, AQo, KQs- call me a nit NIT!!!!!
2) JJ-99, AQs-ATs, AQo-AJo, KQs
3) add KJs, JTs-T9s, KQo to 2)

So in terms of equity AQo is only just >50% for (1), for (2) it is 56.6%. However, equity is relatively meh when we still have flops turns and rivers, so it's not a huge consideration. And that has implications for the value/bluff dichotomy. "If you can't jam for value then you can't 3bet for value" is such a fallacy... Our logic shouldn't be "if we can't 5bet-ship AQ vs a 4bet then we shouldn't 3bet it"..., it should be "if EV(3betting) > EV(calling_and_playing_postflop) > EV(folding) then 3bet". You don't look down at K8o on the BU and say, "well, if I can't 'call for value' against a 3bet, then I shouldn't open raise it".

Against someone folding as often as you do in (1) (I'm assuming you open ~25-30% in CO) then the adjustment is obvious, but we all know people aren't adjusting to that enough! The thing is I don't believe the majority of players - even regs - are folding hands like KJs or even QJs to a SB 3bet. I also don't believe they are 4betting enough to make us adjust our 3bet range drastically (e.g. 22+, AK to 3bet/5bet-jam, or start calling 4bets); instead I think they are flatting a fair amount IP. The fact is that AQ is a high equity hand in terms of absolute strength and we can hit TPTK and be relatively happy bet-bet-betting and getting called down by TPGK. I can't say for sure because it's a bit complex, but I strongly believe that the EV of 3betting AQ (considering all future scenarios as well, not just in a vacuum) is greater than the EV of flatting it from many positions, against many positions, and especially from SB against a CO open.

That's just my opinion, but I really think a lot about this value/bluff stuff. And sorry to mini-hijack the thread! What do you think about my thoughts? Curious to read

I think in this hand you should call preflop as a standard and on this board probably check/call all three streets (or maybe make a small donk on the river).

Originally posted by Alleen86
I think in this hand you should call preflop as a standard and on this board probably check/call all three streets (or maybe make a small donk on the river).

Just call preflop vs CO raise? CO open range is 25-40% so why just call with AQ oop? I dont agree. AQ is strong enough to raise it comparing with CO range.. Maybe if villain was a nit or was EP or MP a call was better, but in this situation raising is the best option imo.

3 bet with AQ is ok here. I just wanted to know where you want togo with it.

Originally posted by 2reac

Originally posted by Alleen86
I think in this hand you should call preflop as a standard and on this board probably check/call all three streets (or maybe make a small donk on the river).

Just call preflop vs CO raise? CO open range is 25-40% so why just call with AQ oop? I dont agree. AQ is strong enough to raise it comparing with CO range.. Maybe if villain was a nit or was EP or MP a call was better, but in this situation raising is the best option imo.

It's ok to 3bet, but I think that against the CO open range of 25% is standard to call. I mean, not only I think that, I'm refering to w34z3l's Walktrough Series. Since we don't know the CO's open range (you didn't mention any info), I would stick to the standard play. Of course, it also depends on the BB. If he is aggressive, then it's better to 3bet. But as I said, from your post we don't have any of this info.