top two pair vs river shove(partypoker fast forward)

I would call. Villain is bluffing here

He could run a stupid bluff with missed draw or something. His line really doesn't make much sense. He will not call flop and turn with 3x. 33 and 88 he really should raise OTF or OTT when there is two flush draws. QQ he would squeeze preflop. I really do not know what he can have there but if he has you beat he played his hand weirdly.

When the board pairs and flushes do not complete with what hands we can call his donk shove? His sizing is quite stupid if it is for value. So I would call and take a note but that is just me...

Pre, flop and turn looks fine.

I would call here. Definitely feels like a bluff. I would have played it the same as you, but I would for sure call the river. His sizing just doesn't make sense. Call and take note.

Well , I am a nit and I am not calling. It is mw he can have 3x.

It is a call on river.
Looks a lot like a busted flush draw
Sets would raise on flop or turn for value and protection, especially with overcards on board
3x would not be calling 2 barrels on this board texture, well, unless he is completely mental

Well it looks like 3x too. 3x that doesn't want you to xb river.

Originally posted by nitrol
Well it looks like 3x too. 3x that doesn't want you to xb river.

How the hell can he call 3/4 bet OTF and OTT with 3x? If he has 3cXc then maybe but it is a bit far fetched. There is not many combos of those but ofc it is possible. That bet size is rediculous. If he has that 3x he wants to get calls from Ax and 2 pair hands and we might have 88 As I said, if villain has something here he played it stupidly.

I am neutral. I agree, it looks like a weird line to take. But there is also the information that he did make a 1.5x pot bet. You need inverted logic to make that look weak.

I'm calling here. Not exactly happy to do it but what is villain repping? 3x should be quite unlikely given the action. AA & QQ should be 3-betting pre. The only hand that beats us is terribly played 88.

Originally posted by YohanN7
I am neutral. I agree, it looks like a weird line to take. But there is also the information that he did make a 1.5x pot bet. You need inverted logic to make that look weak.

Nooooo, you said it yourself.. Big bets are for big hands (and for big bluffs)
I believe that all-in is still pretty popular bluff size among beginners.

Originally posted by la55i

Originally posted by YohanN7
I am neutral. I agree, it looks like a weird line to take. But there is also the information that he did make a 1.5x pot bet. You need inverted logic to make that look weak.

Nooooo, you said it yourself.. Big bets are for big hands (and for big bluffs)
I believe that all-in is still pretty popular bluff size among beginners.

Still neutral. Yes, big bluffs too. The bigger the bet, the more bluffs there should be. You still shouldn't call big bets more the bigger they are. You should call less. This is not paradoxical as so many players seem to think.

If it is your population read that a call is profitable, by all mean call:) I prefer others at the table to make these huge calls (letting me get a real read for free).♦

He probably has quads.

Just kidding, imo Villain could have just misread the strength of his own hand, but it is very likely that he's just bluffing missed draws here.

Originally posted by la55i

Originally posted by nitrol
Well it looks like 3x too. 3x that doesn't want you to xb river.

How the hell can he call 3/4 bet OTF and OTT with 3x? If he has 3cXc then maybe but it is a bit far fetched. There is not many combos of those but ofc it is possible. That bet size is rediculous. If he has that 3x he wants to get calls from Ax and 2 pair hands and we might have 88 As I said, if villain has something here he played it stupidly.

With the pair on board I do not like calling this bet with our hand.
In another hand I told you that strange lines are more likely for value.
I do not have an issue with villain bluffing us. If he did-well done.

Yea I know why you want to fold and it is fine. I'm still not quite convinced that weird lines are more often for value. I remember the hand where you told me that and the next hand I reviewed was also a weird line from villain and he bluffed there. I think it really doesn't matter if we call or fold. I can agree with both. I like gambling

Well, I prefer the safer way.

I might fold this one and suspect he was bluffing