Skip to forum
Please Help Me Prov...
 
Notifications
Clear all

[Closed] Please Help Me Prove Something Insane...

90 Posts
11 Users
19 Reactions
10.2 K Views
yadijavadi
Joined: 31.01.2018

It's pretty straight-forward La - You were saying that; "Level One could relate to our skill pre-flop", that these levels can be fabricated by anyone. But your boss says they were a wonderful discovery.

I didnt really hear a straight answer to my new thing there either... It seems like you are saying that these Levels dont make up a rational thought-process and the reason why that they dont is because people gradually worked them out, and because they aren't special?? …. (cough, your boss said they are wonderful)


la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

The old man just wanted to please you :)
One guy decided to put on paper what he thinks is the development process of a new poker player. Maybe it was well thought back then. No one had ever thought about how the thought process actually gets better and no one didn't put players on skill groups. I wouldn't still call it wonderful :f_biggrin:


la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

I think this is getting a bit crazy and out of hand.
First we talked about whether you presented anything new or not. We talked about the levels and what content you gave them in your book. We explained with multiple examples why we don't think this is anything significant.

Now the discussion has changed and we start talking about whether levels of though, meaning "what I have, what villain could have, what I think villain thinks I have" and so on, exist. And we cling to some small details like one guy in the thread saying "yea it was a wonderful discovery decades ago" instead of "someone already thought about this decades ago".

To get this back on track. Could you shortly tell everyone what still needs to be discussed. Any proof that suggests someone has been wrong before? Because now I think these are just your opinions that really are not significant.
If this is a great strategy, why can I coach a total beginner and explain all he needs to know from beginning till end without using the word level.

Or actually I'm not sure if that is a good idea because that won't probably help us at all. We just go in circles anyway.


yadijavadi
Joined: 31.01.2018

Originally posted by la55i
The old man just wanted to please you :)
One guy decided to put on paper what he thinks is the development process of a new poker player. Maybe it was well thought back then. No one had ever thought about how the thought process actually gets better and no one didn't put players on skill groups. I wouldn't still call it wonderful :f_biggrin:

I'm pretty sure the reason he wrote that real insulting message was not to please me.

Anyway... My young daughter recently came to live with me and so I dont have time for conversations like this. If there is nobody here who think that I have made any kind of advancement to our understanding of strategic theory with my discoveries, like realising that;

- "What I think he thinks I think he has", can easily be translated to "What he is pretending to have".
- GTO exists as Level Infinity
- There is a secret rational thought-process built into our minds which is centred around these Levels
- And that not consciously recognising said formula will cause a psychological problem similar to cognitive dissonace

If none of you think that any of this is either true, or has any value, then I will be on my way.

If there are some beginners here or anybody else who does see the value in these discoveries, and does think that I am correct, I will be happy to discuss it with you. I'll keep a little eye on here for a while just incase.


yadijavadi
Joined: 31.01.2018

You say you want evidence that those before me were wrong, but I have given you this. I have explained every issue you have put forward, but still this conversation is going nowhere.

I agree that this is going in circles. If everybody here is discrediting the things that I've put forward, and you all want me to leave, I am not going to argue with you


Harrier88
Joined: 01.05.2012

Originally posted by yadijavadi
Forgive me, but you and your moderators seem somewhat confused. Does anyone else here agree with me? That these guys are being Irrational, to the point of insanity.

No.


UPAY4DINNER
Joined: 28.09.2009

Originally posted by Harrier88

Originally posted by yadijavadi
Forgive me, but you and your moderators seem somewhat confused. Does anyone else here agree with me? That these guys are being Irrational, to the point of insanity.

No.

This.


TyCobb
Joined: 30.03.2006

Originally posted by yadijavadi

Originally posted by la55i
The old man just wanted to please you :)
One guy decided to put on paper what he thinks is the development process of a new poker player. Maybe it was well thought back then. No one had ever thought about how the thought process actually gets better and no one didn't put players on skill groups. I wouldn't still call it wonderful :f_biggrin:

I'm pretty sure the reason he wrote that real insulting message was not to please me.

Anyway... My young daughter recently came to live with me and so I dont have time for conversations like this. If there is nobody here who think that I have made any kind of advancement to our understanding of strategic theory with my discoveries, like realising that;

- "What I think he thinks I think he has", can easily be translated to "What he is pretending to have".
- GTO exists as Level Infinity
- There is a secret rational thought-process built into our minds which is centred around these Levels
- And that not consciously recognising said formula will cause a psychological problem similar to cognitive dissonace

If none of you think that any of this is either true, or has any value, then I will be on my way.

If there are some beginners here or anybody else who does see the value in these discoveries, and does think that I am correct, I will be happy to discuss it with you. I'll keep a little eye on here for a while just incase.

Hi Yadi. On a rather serious note. Im a father myself. And the responsibility of father is to take care of his child AND his own wellbeing.

What im trying to say is, you should take the help of a doctor and really check your mental health. I dont want to insult you, but the things you write are pretty concerning.

Edit: I am not your enemy and i obv. dont know you. So it is not my place to judge you. But still you seems to be a decent person, so i felt the urge to write the above. I wish you all the best but im out of this threat (will be a silent reader).


la55i
Joined: 27.01.2013

- "What I think he thinks I think he has", can easily be translated to "What he is pretending to have".
- GTO exists as Level Infinity
- There is a secret rational thought-process built into our minds which is centred around these Levels
- And that not consciously recognising said formula will cause a psychological problem similar to cognitive dissonace

Thanks for the list. I already said before that GTO is a math thing. So I would say it can't completely exist on level infinity if we are talking about levels of thought. Because GTO doesn't have that much to do with thinking process.
Thanks for the translation but it is as significant as one person saying that the color is "between very light green and very light blue" and the other person says it is aqua.
Don't believe in secret rational thought processes.
Don't believe in getting mental problems because not understanding the levels.

I would really consider what TyCobb said. I already hinted about that before too.


metalmonkey80
Joined: 15.08.2013

You might laugh it off and call me crazy, you might get angry and think me some sly salesman, you might start talking about some flaw in the logic. There is no flaw. I made $180,000 playing 6max over 2 years when I stopped to work on this. My brother had a poker school. I know what I'm talking about. So if you doubt it, please dont accuse me of being wrong, please dont laugh etc, just explain to me where you think the problem is and I will explain it to you. I think that piece of evidence is solid. So please try to point your problems towards that, if you think I'm mad, please explain why I am the first to realise that at level four we consider what the opponent is pretending to hold.

Hello yadijavadi,

I have over the past few days read a few of the constructive feed back in regards to your book. I personally downloaded it from your link and found that it was not something I was ready to commit a read. Maybe this is due to the way you have dealt with the constructive criticism from fellow pokerstrategists that put me off turning the next page.
I have played poker for 5 years at recreational level. I have had goods times and many bad times, but without the community here would not have carried on. Without sharing my level of understanding and listening to the feedback received by members here, weather it be from a professional player or not I would have failed / given up much earlier on!
I understand that you have put many hours into presenting your view on exploitative theory and the levels of thought and I congratulate you on such a massive task.
But in all reality you yourself have missed the very point of the title of this blog Please Help Me Prove Something Insane...

People are trying to help you prove something insane by constructively helping point areas of your work that need adjusting. You shouldn't post in forums and expect everyone to agree with you and especially if you can't take the criticism / constructive feedback on board. How will we ever learn in life if not from other peoples feedback / help!!

Have you taken the time to look at the wealth of information on this site? You will be surprised how much information there is that covers these points you talk about. It may be from a different angle to yours, but ultimately it is the same.

Originally posted by la55i
Hmm this thread again.. You posted one 6 months ago too.

I didn't read this thread but if I remember correctly, you were very intelligent and your thinking was so brilliant that we mere mortals couldn't understand it. I'm looking forward to reading that book. Hopefully it will give me some clarity.

Clearly from reading La55i response earlier on and other comments throughout this thread you have rubbed up people in the wrong way when ever posting your thoughts and the way you deal with feedback.
I believe that if you adjust your personal approach in future on how you deal with criticism you can, and will create better texts in the future by learning from your readers views / opinions and integrating that into the way you approach future work. This is how good books evolve and I can prove this by pointing that you haven't included any acknowledgments in the book! Did your family have patience with you while you wrote your book and were they patient with the amount of time you spent working on it? How about acknowledgments to anyone else who has helped you? Do you see where I am going with this? When I pick up any book the authors all acknowledge the help they have received from other people in creating a great read!!

Finally I am unable to add to this conversation on the professional levels my colleagues can when dealing with the subject but I can say you are wrong in your approach as it comes across to me that you are unable to converse with other people when they point areas they disagree with you on.
I hold with high regard the active members of this community here on the forums and trust their views and opinions as do many beginners / professional players looking to improve their game or even social network / friends. I disagree with rudeness and arrogance, especially from someone who has a history of this kind of behaviour and doesn't learn.
I am saddened that this thread hasn't been a more positive discussion and you haven't tried to engage with the wider community in other areas along with taking on board the constructive thoughts. I hope that what we have constructively said to you, be it positive or not will help you in future when you next approach people for their feedback or reviews of your work. This is a transferable skill that applies to many areas of life not just poker!

For the sake of anti tilt I am going to lock this thread from future comments. If you wish to continue as a active member of the community I expect a better attitude from you. This is your final warning as I am not going to ask for you to be banned.

Good luck at the tables to everyone :f_thumbsup:

Matt