QQ vs 3b

Joined: 05.08.2007

25.12.2014, 21:57 0

partypoker - $0.04 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 62.75 BB (VPIP: 18.42, PFR: 13.16, 3Bet Preflop: 13.33, Hands: 38)
Hero (SB): 168.25 BB
BB: 141 BB (VPIP: 39.34, PFR: 18.03, 3Bet Preflop: 15.38, Hands: 124)
UTG: 197.5 BB (VPIP: 18.52, PFR: 14.81, 3Bet Preflop: 8.33, Hands: 27)
MP: 127 BB (VPIP: 20.23, PFR: 7.06, 3Bet Preflop: 6.60, Hands: 443)
CO: 125 BB (VPIP: 31.79, PFR: 23.84, 3Bet Preflop: 2.13, Hands: 152)

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has Q♥ Q♣

fold, MP calls 1 BB, CO raises to 6 BB, fold, Hero raises to 11 BB, fold, fold, CO raises to 32 BB, Hero raises to 168.25 BB and is all-in, CO calls 93 BB and is all-in

Flop: (252 BB, 2 players) 8♥ 4♥ 4♣

Turn: (252 BB, 2 players) 2♦

River: (252 BB, 2 players) A♠

Spoiler

CO shows A♣ K♥ (Two Pair, Aces and Fours)
(Pre 44%, Flop 27%, Turn 14%)
Hero shows Q♥ Q♣ (Two Pair, Queens and Fours)
(Pre 56%, Flop 73%, Turn 86%)
Hero wins 43.25 BB
CO wins 239.5 BB

how do you play QQ, AK vs 4bet at this limit? Is it a fold? I filtered average player fold vs 5bet, it is only 10%. So it is most of the time AK, QQ+, and i think that many villians actually stack off only KK+. So could it be a fold with QQ, AK vs 4bet vs unknown guy? could call 4bet be +EV?

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3 replies

_Anonymous_

26.12.2014, 02:47 0

Hi,

I don't think 4bet call is +EV in this spot. What is the plan calling QQ vs a 4bet? Can you still fold in a 4bet pot postflop if
1) you have an overpair with QQ?
2) flop is Axx/Kxx? If villian really holds AK you are pretty much dead now, but you could have shoved Preflop with 56% Equity. If he had KK+ (12 combinations), you have been dead all along but lost value vs AK (16 combinations).

And: you cannot 4bet call for set value. Your 3bet sizing was too small on my opinion.
If you have very strong reads on villian you might can consider folding, but i doubt this is possible at this limit.

Best Regards,
I2azer

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w34z3l

Coach

Joined: 03.08.2009

Posts: 13,366

26.12.2014, 08:58 0

Hey guys,

It depends on our position and the positioner of the opener. If either player is MP or UTG then we can't stack with QQ/AK. In all other situations we can stack preflop for 100bb but need to be cautious as the stacks get deeper.

Call vs 4b can sometimes make sense. It's most useful when our opponent is expected to have a polarized 4betting range + we hold something that does well against his bluffs but not well enough vs his value-hands to shove for value. This can often be things like AQ/KQ/TT-QQ etc but at these limits we have to be careful because many players are just 4betting super tight.

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GingerKid

Joined: 05.08.2007

Posts: 4,913

26.12.2014, 12:20 0

Hi,

Did you see that the average player folds only 10% vs 5bet? that means that they really do it mostly for value, so does it make sense to fold QQ, AK vs 4bet at any positions vs unknown?

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